The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

industrial operation and final product

Onlybuns's picture
Onlybuns

industrial operation and final product

Hello loves,

This website helped me for years! but unfortunately my recent issue did not find an explanation I will try make it short.

today I had the chance to try a machine for mass production which you put a bulk into a hopper and it starts dividing the dough and rounding it (buns production).

in my original method i bulk ferment the dough after kneading (extensive kneading and keeping dough temp 75-80F) for 10-15 minutes after. then dividing it manually.. and start rounding/ shaping them and that would take up to 25minutes of rounding.

so what happen today is that the machine when dividing the dough it kicks almost all the air outside the dough ball then rounding resulting in very small ball in compare with my original method though they share same weight, and even the final result after baking is much smaller. even the crumb inside looks like a commercial bread you find in the store, more like weak structure and short strands inside.

both had same proofing time.

I'm suspecting the machines is breaking the gluten structures out of the piece and that is preventing from rebuild it self to a bigger/ stronger ball. am I correct?

does over shaping the dough would prevent the dough from rise properly ? or weaken the gluten?

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

Do you think the warmth in your hands during hand shaping might contribute to warming up the dough just enough to improved the proofing?  Can you compensate in any way?  

I would think that over shaping the dough would result in stronger, tighter gluten.  Perhaps a run with a lower gluten flour might be interesting?  

Onlybuns's picture
Onlybuns

I work in a controlled temp and round one piece takes no more than 5 seconds so i doubt I'm helping the proofing.

besides when shaping it, it feels the air trapped inside and I intend to keep the air while shaping and making sure it's all seamed and smooth surface. unlike the machines it gives the ball teared up all over the surface so i kept that way and some i took and reshape by hand to cover the tears, but still the air is all out by force.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDCoZs-wupg

that is link for the exact machine.

only way for the machine to give me smooth rounded buns is to throw the bulk right away from the mixer.

Doc.Dough's picture
Doc.Dough

If the machine is completely deflating the dough, you might try shortening the bulk fermentation and increasing the proofing time so that there is less gas to be expelled by the machine.

Onlybuns's picture
Onlybuns

that is true, the machine completely deflate the dough but reduce the bulk ferment will result in very low rise bread, even if i increase the proofing time would result in airy crumb and very weak gluten strands inside. will look like a sponge rather than connected structure. it is a bit hard to describe the look but i will try to post two picture for the hand made and machine with the same dough.

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

soft doughs?  Perhaps a "softer" setting is needed.