The Fresh Loaf

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Sourdough Danish Rye/Rugbrød på surdej

Anonymous baker's picture
Anonymous baker (not verified)

Sourdough Danish Rye/Rugbrød på surdej

Lovely recipe by Stanley Ginsburg from his site theryebaker.com

 

Stage 1 sponge (day one, morning):

  • wholgrain rye flour 63g
  • warm water 63g
  • whole rye starter @ 100% hydration 7g

Left to mature for 10-12 hours.

 

Stage 2 sponge (day one, evening):

  • stage 1 sponge
  • wholegrain rye flour 422g
  • warm water 422g
  • salt 25g
  • blackstrap molasses 31g
  • seed mix (pumpkin, sunflower, flax and sesame) 192g

Covered and left to stand overnight for 10-12 hours. 

 

Final Dough (day two, morning):

  • stage 2 sponge
  • cracked rye 315g
  • whole-wheat flour 148g
  • beer 201g

Mixed, portioned out into loaf pan (2/3rds full) and final proofed for 3-5 hours till it reached the rim and the top showed numerous bubbles.

Brushed with water and baked at 225°C till ready (60-70 minutes). 

 

Thank you Stanley. 

 

Notes:

1. Quite high percentage of salt. If we include the cracked rye then it comes in at 2.6%. If we don't (as it's not exactly flour) then it comes in at 3.9%. I did make too much dough so put aside 200g ish to make a rye roll and when I had it with peanut butter (which does have a little salt) it's a tad too salty. Still a lovely tasting bread all the same but if I were to repeat it I think I'd drop the salt %.

2: Interesting enough the salt is added into stage 2 of the recipe making it 6% in the preferment. We're always told that salt will inhibit the activity of the starter. However the preferment rose very well indeed! 

 

Comments

DesigningWoman's picture
DesigningWoman

The perfect flat top, so your calculations are spot on.

Lovely recipe, lovely color, can't wait for crumb shot and taste report. Your flat must've smelt wonderful!

You'll let rest for 24 hrs?

Bravo Abe!

Keep on baking, 

Carole 

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

So I out aside 200g and made a bread roll. Turns out that 1600g for this rye recipe was perfect for the pullman. I've added some notes to the recipe Carole, should you wish to try it. I've had the roll and it was delicious! This whopper of a loaf is not being cut into till tomorrow. 

Thank you Carole. 

DesigningWoman's picture
DesigningWoman

I hadn't gotten as far as calculating your final dough weight, that's a lot of bread! But it sounds so delicious that it will be a delight eating your way through it.

Most of the recipes on the site call for ingredients that are as scarce as hen's teeth. The best I can come up with is dark rye, whole rye berries and rye flakes. But a friend of mine is going to Denmark in a few months, and I've already given her my shopping list 😊. Once I have the ingredients in hand, would love to bake one with you. I've been hankering the Auvergne sourdough rye...

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

For a bread flour dough it'll be different. One has to take into account the flour, hydration etc. Rye bread is dense and doesn't rise as much hence the whopper of a dough. I just love this bread. Such a rich flavour and full of seeds. 

If you can buy whole rye berries then I imagine a few seconds (3 or 4 quick pulses) in a coffee grinder will give you cracked rye. Other then that all you need is the seeds. I imagine bulgur wheat would be a good substitute for the cracked rye too.

It is a great site for all things rye. I can see you're very eager to give it a go. Hope your friend comes back with all the goodies but until then find a recipe that you can make do with all the ingredients you have. 

David R's picture
David R

Commercial machinery cracks grain much more neatly than the home coffee grinder, with more-uniform pieces and much less dust - but surely it would be good enough, for a small quantity.

Cracked wheat or bulgur wheat don't taste the same as rye - but they still taste good, and work fine as a substitute.

AlisonKay's picture
AlisonKay

Does it hold together well for a sandwich?

Maybe the molasses counteracts the effect of the salt in the preferment?

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

The roll I made with the leftover dough did. Held together very nicely. Will slice into this one tonight. I'm trying to lean more towards wholegrain now. Will do the occasional bread flour as a mix but want to aim for healthy breads. 

Thanks Alison. 

P.s. I'm not sure if the molasses can counteract the salt chemically.  

DesigningWoman's picture
DesigningWoman

the crumb shot? :-D

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

Haven't cut into it yet. Hopefully tonight. 

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

Dense (which is how it's supposed to be) but a nice soft crumb with a bit of a bite due to the cracked rye. Even in rye breads that have a more open crumb my knife hasn't come out so clean after cutting. Slices up so well and with ease. One slice is really filling and so flavoursome. A hearty bread.

DesigningWoman's picture
DesigningWoman

but I can devine that it lookls great! I hope you're enjoying every morsel of it.

 

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

Trying to find the best way to incorporate both the loaf and crumb shot. Want to rely on one photo. Getting used to the app :)

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

at least once!  Then they would be hooked.  Now you can pumpernickel the same recipe and see how low and slow baking with the id on effects the taste in such a huge way.  Looks like it needs to have about anther 75 g of dough in the pan though - still very close!  Enjoy the rare treat of a really fine rye bread Abe!

Well done and happy baking!

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

I certainly do recommend this bread. Tasty and very filling. A hearty loaf. 

Now when you say pumpernickel it do you mean I should change the whole rye flour? Swap it out completely (apart from the cracked rye)? Not sure if I've come across pumpernickel rye.

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

say baking with falling temperatures ending up at 100 C for a few hours.  That will really bring out the rye flavor  Here are a few that Lucy has on file:

Norm Berg’s Black Pumpernickel

 

About 1 hour before bake time, preheat your oven to 500°F/255°C, with the baking surface in the middle and a steam pan on a lower shelf.   Bake for 15 minutes and reduce heat to 400°F/205°C. After 15 minutes more, reduce heat to 300°F/150°C and continue baking until the center of the loaf reaches an internal temperature of 210°F/100°C, 80-90 minutes. Remove to a rack and let cool for at least 24 hours before cutting.

 

Andy’s Black Pumpernickel

 

Pre-heat the oven to 280°C. Load the pan, apply steam, and turn the oven down to 110°C. Keep a supply of steam in the oven and bake for a total of 4½ - 6 hours.

 

Hammelman’s Pumpernickel

 

Place the pans in the oven and bake at 350°F for 1 hour.

Turn oven down to 325°Fand bake for 30 minutes.

Turn oven down to 300°F and bake for 1 hour.

Turn oven down to 275°F and bake for 2 hours.

Turn oven down to 260°F and bake for 2 hours.

Turn oven down to 225°F and bake for 1 1/2 hours.

Turn oven down to 200°F and bake for 1 1/2 hours.

Turn oven off at 11 pm and leave pans in oven until morning (oven was still warm)

 

Dabrownman’s Revised JH Schedule

 

375 F - 30 minutes

350 F - 30 minutes

325 F - 30 minutes

300 F – 30 minutes

275 F - 30 minutes

250 F - 1 hour

225 F - 1 hour

200 F - 1 hour

Turn oven off and leave the bread in the oven until morning or 8 hours

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/32497/100-whole-grain-rye-and-spelt-yw-sd-scald-and-seeds-altus-test

 

Another JH Variation

 

400 F - 30 minutes

375 F - 30 minutes

350 F - 30 minutes

325 F - 30 minutes

300 F - 1 hour

275 F - 2 hours

250 F - 2 hours

225 F - 1 ½ hours

200 F - 1 ½ hours

Let rest innoven for 8 hours

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/32781/ww-sd-yw-multigrain-pumpernickel

 

Another BM Variation

 

375 F - 30 minutes

350 F - 30 minutes

325 F - 2 hours

235 F - 2 hours

200 F - 2 hours

 

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/32943/whole-grain-dapumpernickel-aroma-bread

 

DB’s White Pumpernickle

 

375 F - 30 minutes

350 F - 30 minutes

325 F - 1 hour

300 F - 1 hour

275 F - 1 hour

250 F - 1 hour

225 F - 1 hour

 

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/32982/two-way-75-white-bread-dapumperized-scald-and-seeds

 

 

 

Best Pumpernickel Bake Schedule

 

350 F - 1 Hour

300 F - 2 Hours

250 F - 3 Hours

225 F - 3 Hours

200 F - 4 Hours

Turn off oven and leave for 8 hours

 

Bread1965's picture
Bread1965

Hi Abe.. I think I'm going to give this a try on your prodding. 

Two questions first.  #1 Stanley talks about this bread being very sour - how sour is it? I 'm not a fan of very sour breads;  and 

#2 Did you use a lid when baking? I don't have a true pullman loaf pan and was going to use a glass pyrex loaf pan. Thoughts?

 

Ok. One more.. I don't have a dedicated rye starter. I'm thinking if i simply feed my regular starter rye flour for two or three feedings, that should be fine. Thoughts on that?

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

Too be honest it's so packed full of goodies they lend lots of flavour. I don't think sour is too dominant. The other stuff add a lot more tasty notes. 

I did use a lid. My Pullman has one. I like the lid as it solves steaming issues. Don't see why you can't spray the top of the loaf with a but of added extra steam. 

Sounds great to me. I have a rye and that's what I do for a wheat starter build. 

Best of luck Frank. I'm sure you'll love it!