Why did you put evaporated milk in the dough, does it do some thing special,,,,, curious,,,,, Thanks, qahtan

Here's my take on your honey whole wheat - must admit I didn't use evap milk but dried whole milk powder and wholemeal/white spelt bread flour. The loaf smelt great cooking. I left it to cool when we went to bed but my husband got up in the night (foxes in the garden making a racket) so the loaf looked like this when I got up! :))

What would the measurements be if I used cups instead of pounds and ounces?

I tried this bread because of the Good Earth connection. I sure miss their wonderful soups and the cashew chicken salad! The sandwich rolls were wonderful, first night I used them with grilled portobella mushrooms. The rest of the rolls did duty in my husband's lunch pail. This bread is going to be a regular for us. I will try making loaves at the next baking.

Thanks, Floydm, I love this site.

I definitely want to try this out!! I'll have to see how much flour we have....

hi

can i just use plain milk/ or do i need to use milk powder

pl let me know me soon as i intend to make it today and i have a 5month old and need to paln accordingly

I have tried this recipe *sooo* many times and my family loves the taste of this bread, BUT...I always get deflated loaves.  What am I doing wrong?  Can anyone help me trouble shoot, please?

GardenGal

What should be the temperature of the hot water? 

GardenGal

I made the bread and it is cooling now.  Smells delicious.  I just realized when I was making it that it doesn't contain any shortening.  Is there a reason for that?

Also, I reversed the white flour and whole wheat flour amounts because I make it in my Cuisinart and they recommend using only a cup of whole wheat flour.  Because ww flour is harder on the machine, I guess.  I added 8 oz which is more than a cup though.

I'v read throughout this site that ingredients should be weighed. Should I be weighing the ingredients here? I did for the wheat flour and water, and it seems awefully thick, as in not enough water. Is this what I should be expecting?

Steph

Just found this site a week ago and decided to try this bread last weekend. Some success and some issues. I was hoping someone could help shed some light on a few of the issues.

1. My first try, my dough never rose. Two probable causes, but not sure which was to blame. I used older wheat flour I had sitting around. Could old flour cause problems? I also didn't knead the dough that long. 4 minutes by machine, let rest to cool the moter, then another 4-5 minutes. The dough felt good and looked good, but I forgot to check the temp and didn't window pane. Even after 3 hours on the counter, the dough had only gained 1/4 volume. In fridge overnight and not much better.
2. Tried again the next day (I don't like failure). Kneeded longer this time (8 on, 8 rest, 9 on). Good rise (so maybe this was it, though I did use new flour also). When I baked, I got a good spring but also got a couple of big blisters that burned. What causes the skin to blister badly? - 4" dia. blister on one loaf. Shaping technique, bread too high in the oven???

Thanks, Matt Wood

I made this recipe and it turned out well except the crust is quite pale. I cooked until the internal temperature was 225, so I don't think cooking any longer is the solution. What do you think is causing it? My two thoughts are either that it is the oven losing too much heat when I initially put in the loaf or the dough was too dry to begin with. I don't have a baking stone but I will probably buy one soon.

Thanks

GardenGal

 In order to make your bread crust dark, brush with an egg wash before baking.  Happy bread making!

I have tried to make this formula twice and today I made an effort to make sure it was hydrated. With 3 T of Yeast it should rise like crazy. I get a decent primary ferment but after I form the loaves it won't rise above a standard pan and doesn't really fill the sides.

The only change I mad was I split the WW and AP 50/50 instead of a pound of WW and 1/2 pound AP. I haven't baked the batch yet but it isn't looking good and it's been 10 hours in the pans.

It looks like they actually fell some instead of rising. I love whole wheat but so far no luck.

Eric

yeah...I've made similar looking housebricks too!!

V... 

After looking at this thread and seeing the large number of flops I'm wondering if maybe you could define how much kneading or what kind of gluten development you are using. I have done this now with Bobs Red Mill WW and KA and had almost no rise after maybe 25% at the first. I really don't want to add natural Gluten additive unless I can't get it to rise any other way.

I noticed that the mixer wasn't getting it done so I kneaded on the counter and the dough finally did develop somewhat and start to feel a little like what I am used to with AP flour. The loaves I posted above were cooked to 190 and tasted great if dense. Nothing like the beautiful sandwich loaf pictured at the top.

How about a tutorial on handling WW dough?? JMonkey you are the god of WW breads, please show compassion for us lowly flatlanders :0)

 Eric

that this initial mixture is just a 'pre-soak' to give the whole wheat a bit of a headstart. It would definitely be a thick pasty sort of affair. The hydration at this stage shouldn't much matter- you can always correct it when you go to mix the final dough, and don't forget you've still got milk and honey to add. Just be sure to keep it covered! It may be that your coarse flour is absorbing a lot more. When I make 100% whole wheat I usually make a sponge in which some of the flour and a little yeast sit in most of the liquid  for an hour or more.

I made this bread last night.  The result was somewhere between the aforementioned building bricks and a well risen loaf.  Was all I could do to resist cutting into it at midnight last night.

 I'm going to try it again this weekend with the longer soak and more kneadiing.  I, too, must tame the grain  :)

They are in the oven but here is the problem I had:

i added over a cup of bread flour at the end as I was kneading and the bread was very slack and sticky. I was afaid to add any more flour to it so I just set it to rise. It rose a lot. When it was time to shape I really couldn't, it was very wet. So I more or less just split it in half and put it in the pans. It rose again quite nicely. I don't think I overproofed it but now in the oven the tops look flat. Is that because I couldn't shape it?

I was just afraid to add too much flour, after I had already added an additional cup or so! :(

It smells good in the oven  - lets see what happen. There is one other thing I did differently, I used the water left over from boiling potatos - the first 12 oz.of hot water.

Honey Wheat loaves: There were such a variety of results for this bread I thought I'd give it a go to take a break from artisan/sourdough 101. Found it to be a good, servicable recipe resulting in a tender , good-tasting bread. I did an over-night soaker as suggested by JMonkey, the 12 oz water was just enough to wet the fairly coarse whole wheat I was using. Proceeded in the morning without digression except 17 oz water total plus 2 tbsp dried buttermilk powder and 2 tbsp oil, another seemly suggestion by the granola god. I added about a cup more white flour, probably could've managed with less but still the dough was tacky and responsive. It rose well, I folded twice just to be agreeable but don't think it needed it, the dough was in good shape all along. The final proof took no more than an hour. No preheat, I set the oven at 450 for 10 minutes then turned it down to 350 to finish the bake. My suggestion to anyone struggling with this is don't be afraid to toss in a little more flour-- the slackness of an artisan loaf really isn't necessary or even valuable here. As written the recipe produces a very managable dough, but we all know that flours are as tempermental as horses. And don't overproof--the surface full of bubbles that might be so admired on your Ciabatta would in my experience foretell a sandwich loaf that will collapse en route to your cooling rack.

Well,

Yes I think that the problem with mine was that it was to wet, and maybe slightly overproofed, but it taste good so it's al' right!

I found a link here to Good Earth Rolls recipe and on another site some one was discussing it and said it was from the restaurant but I'm not familiar with it.  You could give it a glance and see if this is it.

http://articles.urbanhomemaker.com/index.php?page=index_v2&id=132&c=9

Your recipe sounds really good and I'm going to try it.  I had wanted to try substituting honey in my grandmother's bread recipe for the sugar.  I wonder how that would be different but also the same.  (chuckle)

Ok, I'll start the ball rolling with a failed loaf of Tomsbread WW that I would have thought was perfect. The final proof was about 3 hours in 80 degrees covered with plastic wrap and gently removed. They looked nice going in about 1-1/2 inches above the pan. When they were done, the top looks like an all terrain test grounds. The first slice tells the story. I'm guessing over proofing causes this but I sure don't know how to avoid it. Any suggestions? The killer is it tasts great! That 100% long cold ferment really brings out the flavors of the wheat/rye/malt.

Eric

I'm not familiar with the recipe - what is it!  Please tell me - it looks like wonderful bread.

My guess would be you overproofed but since this is sourdough perhaps not and I'm terrible at determining proper proof. How's that for a stab at helping! :o) Also perhaps you did not get enough surface tension in your loaves when you formed them and that is why the top crust separated. 

I haunt 2ndhand bookstores for cookbooks! This recipe is from an oldie but goodie called Uprisings - The Whole Grain Bakers' Book, first published in 1983 by an assn. of bakeries producing "real bread" in coop workplaces. Recipes from all their member bakeries, this one from the Uprisings Baking Collective of Berkeley CA.

Honey Bran Bread 

Sponge:

1 1/8 cup warm water

1 tablespoon barley malt

3 tablespoons honey

2 cups whole wheat flour

1 tablespoon active dry yeast

Combine malt and water. Stir in yeast until dissolved. Beat in flour well; let rise until doubled in size.

Dough:

1 cup wheat bran

1 cup water

Sponge (all of above)

3 1/4 cups whole wheat flour

2 tablespoons safflower oil

1/4 teaspoon salt

Soak the wheat bran in 1 cup water for a few minutes. Mix the sponge, bran and other ingredients together. Knead well until dough has a uniform feel. Let rise until doubled. Punch down and shape into two 1 1/2 lb. loaves. Let rise again. Bake 35 minutes at 375°F.

I made this delicious bread today.  It turned out very soft and very delicious.  

I left the whole wheat flour and water a little longer since I was out of the house, so it sat for 4 hours.   I let it rise in the oven with the light turned on and I put the pans in a cold oven with a pan of just boiled water.  I always find that the crusts of my breads are just too chewy, but this was so tender.  Plus I added a bit more honey on the top just before baking.

 This is a keeper.  I would post a picture if I knew how.

I made it yesterday and it's by far the best ww bread I've had.  I've been experimenting with different ingredients and I think the hot water has a lot to do with the end result.  I found the taste almost nutty and the bread was the best I've ever made.  I need to know if the secret is hot water or the evaporated milk.  I will be posting as soon as I try it again and change it to dry milk.  Happy baking all!

I will be the first to admit that while I enjoy baking, yeast breads have never been one of my most successful ventures, especially when it came to whole wheat breads. Mine were always heavy, dense, and I was not a fan. I ran out of bread today and didn't have the chance to go to the store, so I tried this recipe (only substituting brown sugar and water forthe honey.) I am hooked. This is the lightest, tastiest whole wheat bread I have ever made! I never knew to let the wheat ferment... That make a huge difference! My 1 1/2 year old son keeps asking for more, and it's not been out of the oven 20 minutes... between the two of us almost half a loaf has been eaten. This is going to be a favorite for a LONG LONG time!

 I seem to be having trouble, but I attribute that to being new at baking bread. (I basically have no idea what I'm doing)
First off,  12oz doesn't seem to be enough water to soak the whole wheat will using a few more ounces cause the dough to be too wet?
They didn't have any Instant yeast at my store so the lady in the bakery gave me some of their cake yeast how much and how would I use that for this recipe? Do I just throw it in and call it good?

And the last two problems, When I mix everything together it's extremely sticky and wet. I tried wetting my hands with water when I knead it and that helps but I think I'm missing a step (maybe not kneading it enough?) cause I can't get it to rise either!
If someone has a link to a site that can show me a step by step pictorial of how to knead I would really appreciate it.

And in other news I now how a second batch of lovely brown bricks!

Thanks in advance =)

Hi,

I am not at all an experienced person in baking. but tried above recipe from FloydM and came out almost well.

can somebody advise if I wish to add sun flower seeds and prefer to mix some wheat bran ...how and at which point I can add these ??

Thanks in advanace.

i made this bread for the first time today and the same thing happened to me-not much rise but the flavor is great. i was wondering what size pan do you suggest? i used my pyrex 9x whatever and wondered if it was supposed to go in a smaller pan.

thanks

colleen

  This is my second time baking bread, and while the taste and texture are really great, the loaves come out rather small. This is alright for simply snacking on it, or for eating it with soup and pasta, but not so great for making sandwiches (unless they're miny ones :P)... I'd really like to be able to make sandwiches with the bread I bake -- Any tips? 

I make this recipe about every two weeks; my wife likes it a lot.  At her suggestion I started adding raisins.  I use about 2/3rds of the full recipe for a 9x5 loaf pan, and add about 1/3rd cup raisins just before finishing mixing the dough.

for the whole process?

baking as well?

If you use regular milk instead of evaporated, your bread won't be as rich. Evaporated milk mixed with equal amounts of water give you regular milk, so, from the can, it's twice as rich as regular milk. Unless, of course, you use evaporated SKIM milk, which when mixed with equal amounts of water will equal regular skim milk.

Whether it would make a difference in your product, I'm not really sure, but I've seen a lot of recipes that call for evaporated milk instead of regular, or add powdered milk along with the regular, to make it richer.

Hello,

I bake this recipe every few weeks.  I guess I am not very good at baking since I always end up with different amounts of bread.

For me, I've noticed that I have to add more yeast then the recipe calls for (and I have proofed it and made sure it's good) I also add 3 tblsp of gluten to the whole wheat flour, which I add water to and then all that to sit for about 45 min before I start. 

If I don't add extra yeast and gluten - I have problems with rising.  My rises take longer (90-180 minutes) 

By the second rise sometimes the bread doesn't rise up that much more.

I have also read that the kneading should take about 15 minutes.  I can never knead that long because the dough feels "done" after about 5 min.  It gets very hard to work with after this.

Do you think there is something wrong with my kneading and that's causing the first problem?

BTW- when it works well, the bread is DELISH.  When it doesn't, it's still good, but it's like a rock and it smells like yeast a little.

Rob

I just finished making this bread for the second time. The first time I made it I was having trouble determining the right amount of flour so I went with 3 cups. I didn't have evaporated milk so I used whole milk. I also did not knead the bread nor make the tri-fold!! Boy, what was I thinking. In the end the bread was really tasty, but had little rise and was dense. My kids ate almost all of the first day. So, this is now about 5 days later and I decided to try it again. I read all of the advice and comments about baking bread, kneading bread, how to get a good rise, etc. So, I changed the following this go around. I made sure I used evaporated milk, added  a tad more water to the flour as mine was initially dry, kneaded the dough in my kitchen aid with my dough hook for about 8 minutes and made sure I did the tri-fold and didn't handle the dough too much in making the fold. The end result was great. I will post photos later today!

I just baked this yesterday and it turned out great.

I was experimenting with white whole-wheat flour for the first time and was quite happy with the results.

Perfect sandwich bread.

You can see pictures and read more about my experience with this bread at Flour Girl.

Happy baking!

Floydm you the good fellow, your recipes one of the best, who has learnt you? :-)

I have to try this formula over the weekend.  I love whole grain baked goods, focus mainly on sourdough starter breads and stay away from commercial yeast.  I caved recently and bought instant yeast from KA so we can have bread regardless of how busy I am with the day job and quilt projects.  My husband wants dried fruit and nuts in all his sandwich breads so I think this is the perfect recipe to work with since I have an all day event on Saturday.  I have copied notes from JMonkey and Browndog along with the formula from Floyd and the Honey Bran from Apprentice.  I have a wonderful Kitchenaid and have never used it to knead bread since this is the only food item that I love to get my hands into.  I just might give it a shot with this one anyway.  I find my breads rise much faster here in Santa Fe which I attribute to the altitude so I really have to watch my proofing times.

I just love this forum but it makes it hard for me to focus on my day job since this a lot more fun to read than how to transition from Exchange 2003 to 2007:-).

Hopefully I have some nice loaves to share sometime Sunday from these formulas.  I have BR's Whole Grains bread book so I need to sit down with it one evening soon.

Melody in Santa Fe