Looks really , really good. :-)))) qahtan

I too tried this recipe this past w/e. Used the 'no-knead' method. The bread turned out awesome. I used a high hydration percentage on my loaf. The crumb was similar to ciabatta. The oven spring was extraordinary. The flavor was excelllent. Looking forward to trying my Challah bread this w/e. Used the no-knead method on this one also. Then froze the loaves before shaping and final rise. I'll take two out of the freezer on Thursday. Put them in the refrigerator and shape, proof, and bake on Friday for Saturday's oneg.

Gordon

I am in heaven.... now that I've found this great site. My initial thought, when I came upon the picture of the Rustic Bread was : "Oh My.....What a lovely loaf !".
The preferment is already put together. And my plan is to try baking this one tomorrow.
I have a question about mixing/blending the preferment with the dry the ingredients. I don't have a stand mixer and have rheumatoid arthritis in my hands. Could one blend the preferment with the 12.5 oz. of water first? Then once it is dissolved... add the remaining ingredients ? I'm thinking this would eliminate the difficulty of incorporating it with the rest of the ingredients.

So far...so good. The preferment dissolved nicely in the water and the remaining ingredients incorporated easily. Had to set the loaves in the oven on the proofing cycle because it is quite cold here today..
Can't wait to see the results.

I always have difficulty mixing the dry and wet ingredients. I followed the recipe exactly but I keep getting a very sticky dough that I had to keep adding more flour and end up working with the dough for quite a long time.

http://lindsaysbakery.blogspot.com

Has anyone attempted this beauty? It looks like a wonderful Holiday goodie. Any pointers before I dive in would be a help.

huh? Couronne? Are you talking about the bread image at the top, which Floyd baked and I ate ;)
???
or is couronne another bread-type and this question got misplaced in this forum topic? Google isnt even showing me any meaningful results... it's a crown in french...uh.

Can someone help me with Ciabatta I'v tried to make this bread about 6 times and everytime I make it there is NOT ENOUGH LARGE HOLES in the bread. the dough is very soupy lots of water what am i doing wrong HELP

Elagins@sbcglobal.net

Try using about 70-75% water to flour and use the strongest bread flour you can find. I buy 25# bags of ConAgra bread flour at Costco, which works just fine, and I add about 5% coarse-ground whole wheat flour, which I think gives better flavor. I also use a wet pre-ferment that has approximately the same flour-water proportions, plus 1/2 tsp or so of active dry yeast (which I hydrate before adding).

The key, I think, is to knead for a long time ... usually 10-12 minutes at low speed on my Kitchen Aid, then turn it out onto a heavily floured work surface. I also stretch and fold the dough 2-3 times over 2 hours or so, then form my loaves and put them onto individual pieces of oiled and semolina'ed parchment paper. I let them proof en couche and bake them on a stone using Reinhart's hearth-baking technique (preheat to 550F with steam pan, add steam over the next 2-3 minutes, then turn the oven down to 450 and bake for 20 minutes or so). I've also found that spritzing the loaves with water before I bake them gives me a much thicker, chewier crust.

So far, I've had very good success with this method ... in fact, of all the breads I make, my wife likes this one best.

Another thing that helps with the large holes is to be careful not to degass. In other words, don't knead after the first time. As it doubles, just fold it over lightly a couple of times and let rise, again. Don't press hard on the dough. What makes for good holes is wet dough and light handling.

Nancy

You mention Jeffrey Hamelman's book of techniques and recipes. Is it strong on techniques; does it have good photos showing the techniques? I'm a visual learner.
I really emjoy this site. Keep up the good work.

Interesting - that is the first recipe I have seen with salt in the preferment. I take it that does not kill the yeast too early?

sPh

My first attempt at rustic bread turned out well despite a few deviations from the recipe (about a tablespoon extra water and a 16 hour ferment time before refrigeration overnight and forgetting to put salt in the final dough). I just have to salt each piece of bread before I eat it :-). Thank you for the wonderful, forgiving recipe.

I had difficulty with the shaping though; the dough was pretty soft and I do not have a couche or a banneton or that piece of wood for transferring the loaf from a couche to a peel; moving the slack dough from the proof station to the peel was nearly disastrous. I am thinking of proofing and baking it in the future on the "perforated french bread baguette pan" from Chicago Metallic

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004R91I/ref=pd_kar_gw_3/102-8508791-4598563?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance&n=284507

Does anybody have experience with this? I am trying to spend money that will make a difference, not just spend money; the pan is $20.00. I have also ordered a 60" by 36" piece of #10 cotton duck canvas for 11.00, including shipping, from www.ahh.biz to serve as a couche.

Anyway, thanks for helping me bring the best bread I have ever baked into my house, shaped like a corkscrew and undersalted, but otherwise beautiful, delicious, and with a wonderful texture.

I agree with Nancy - wet dough, light handling . It is amzaing how just folding increases the strength and elasticity of the dough.
The old fashioned idea of "knock the hell out of it" is just so wrong!!!

The dough for my 4th version of rustic bread is now fermenting. My first try was shaped the best, but I mismeasured salt and perhaps the water. The next 2 tries I measured very carefully, doublechecking, verifying. The dough was a batter, I literally had to pour it onto the baking tiles. So this time (some weeks later) I didn't immediately put all water for the final dough into the stand mixer bowl; I added it slowly during the mixing process.

After mixing slowly while adding the water, I had a dough that barely came away from the mixer bowl, very sticky, with the splat-splat sound of sticky dough splashing against the mixer bowl just eliminated.

There was 3 7-8 ounces (i.e. almost 4 ounces) of water held back. I will proceed with the fermentation, folding, proofing, shaping, etc, and post my results.

After the April budget crunch in my household passes, I think I will also buy the Hamelman Techniques book, to see what he says about the texture of the dough after mixing. I loved the flavor of my 1 inch high bread that I poured onto the tiles, but I'd like it even better in the shape of a loaf :-).

Well, I think the bread needed the extra water after all; the crumb had very tiny holes, and folding the dough was difficult.

I found the relevant Hamelman book chapter on line
http://media.wiley.com/product_data/excerpt/72/04711685/0471168572.pdf
and saw a few details about the mixing and shaping that I didn't fully appreciate before.

All in all, I like this bread a lot, and appreciate the suggestion by someone (Floyd?) to work a single recipe over and over and see the effects of varying the processes and ingredients.

Thank you for the opportunity to learn and share here.

John

I am trying to make the bread...  but am having a very difficult time "Folding" the bread...  I can't even pick the bread up it is so slack.  I can tell the gluten has developed well when I stretch it with my fingers to a very thin window. To fold the dough I just picked  up one side and stretched it over the other side several times.  I saw no holes in the bread like I was expecting. I was excited to see that the preferment had nice sized holes, but am not seeing the holes in the "Rustic Loaf" when folding??(yet)  Seems like the recipe was ease to follow...  but not seeing the best results yet...  

 ahhhhhh...  and another thing...  I totally miscalculated the time line of the bread...  and I am bush wacked tonight and need to go to bed... I put the bread in the refer for the night after the 2.5hrs rise time and plan on letting the bread raise tomorrow night before baking...  this gunna be ok??

PJ3...  Provo, UT

Can I go from the refridgerator to the oven??  with this bread??

I often go from the fridge to the oven. No need to let the cold dough heat up. Just put it in the very hot oven, steam it and it bakes very nicely.

 I shared a recipe with a friend and she questions making bread w/o any sugar in the recipe to feed the yeast.  It was the Rustic bread recipe.  I've been making it w/o sugar but my wife added some sugar while making the recipe and hers did seem to raise higher than mine.  Any opinions on adding sugar either way?

I forgot to tell you thanks for posting such a great recipe.  We haven't purchased any bread from over a month.  We alternate between the Italian and Rustic recipes.  I must admit that I use all white flour for the Rustic Bread. 

Still Trying to find a good loaf of bread in South Florida!

Thank you for sharing a fantastic recipe. The bread had the perfect texture and saltiness, and just the right crust. I'll be making this many more times in the future!

Hi,

I love your bread blog. My dad is an excellent baker and we have tried some of your recipes over the holidays. We made the rustic loaves for our Christmas dinner and everyone loved them! We also made Peter's cranberry walnut celebration bread...it is a great recipe as well.  Thank you for all of your tips! 
We are in the process of trying the cinnamon raisin oatmeal recipe...the dough is rising:)  I will try to send pictures soon!  

A question: What brand of thermometer do you use?? My dad needs a new one. Any recommendations?  Thanks again!
Maria 

I began this loaf last night.

I mixed the preferment and it didnt seem to have anough water as the dough wasnt completely mixed so I added about an extra 1/2 to 3/4 of a cup of water. The dough still seemed too stiff but I left it. This morning I came out and saw that the preferment had more than doubled in size and I was relieved.

I mixed the final dough, and it didnt need all of the water or it would have been too slack. I kneeded it and left it for 45 mins. I then folded it and have timed it for an extra 45 mins. This is where I am up to now.  I planed to fold it twice like the recipe says and decided that folding it at 45 min intervals in the beginning of the fermenting/rising period was a good idea so that it had the last hour untouched to rise.

My worry is that since mixing the final dough this morning, it hasnt risen much.It seems like its asleep :S

I am afraid that I;ll end up with a heavy bread.  Is it just rising slowly becuase of the little amount of yeast in it? (until now I have been practicing my skils with lesson one and two, and felt confident enough to try something else) I'm due to fold it again in about half an hour. SO I will see how it goes.

Fingers crossed.

lol. I am in Australia.....in midsummer!  admittedly it has been a cool summer and my new place is cooler than most houses. I have it sitting on top of the oven and turn the oven on for 5 mins and then turn it off so that the kitchen is warmer.

I might stick it in with the light on. :)  and I'll allow it an extra 45 mins between the next fold. DOes that mean after I fold it I still allow the last hour for it to rise? Sorry to sound daft......still pretty green at this baking thing :)

Thanks for your advcice floyd! It's very much appreciated :)

:) Cool.

Thanks for the reassurance Floyd. Yeah the yeast is good. I made a basic loaf yesterday for breakfast today and it was great, so it is just me getting used to the slowness of low-yeast rising. At least I know now :)

It is going nicely at the moment. I'm due to fold it again in about 20mins, and am going to wait and be patient and let it do its thing. I cant wait to taste this one :D

ooooohhhhhhh I have two very lovely looking loaves in the oven :)

fingers crossed XX :D 

YUMMO!

Apart from burning the crusts a bit the bread turnedout deeeelishious! I am sitting here eating a still warm slice. :) The crum is lovely and the taste is morish! This is going to become my regular bread recipe for a while :)

Thanks for all your help Floyd :)

They rose nicely and it took maybe an extra hour on top of the alotted time in the recipe......I was also impatient, so if I had have waited longer I am sure it would have been even better :)

Yay! for my ever improving bread baking skills. I will be able to make use of my Xmas pressie soon :D (I got BBA for Xmas)

I received the large, bell shaped Le Clouch for Xmas, and I decided to use this recipe for a comparitive test. I used the quantities listed above, but mixed all at one time to use the Kneadless method. The only change that I made was to use 1/2 tsp yeast. After mixing, the dough sat at RT for 18 hours. At that time, I roughly divided it into two halves.

The first half, I envelope folded, let sit for 30 minutes, and formed it into a ball.

The instructions that come with the clouch say to put the ball into the bottom of the clouch, cover with the cold bell, and let rise till doubled. Then put it in a 450 oven for 15 min., then reduce to 400 for another 15 min., remove the cover and bake for another 10 min. or so. I followed these instructions exactly, except after 1 hr. rising, it was only about 1 1/2 original size, but because it was spreading out, I put it in the oven at this point.

The results seemed excellent. I got a golden loaf more than 2 times the size of the original ball. Coming out of the oven, it had a thin, crispy crust, but unfortunately, after it cooled, all of the crust became soft, except for the bottom, which had been on the stone bottom. The crumb was very nice, with some medium sized (1/4-3/8") large holes, and the taste was excellent.

The second batch had to be refrigerated for 5 hours or so, and after a 1 hour warmup, was prepared like the first one, but it was risen in a linen lined basket. My normal, flat stone and the top of the clouch were put in the 500 oven for 1 hour.

Once again, I didn't get a lot of rise in the basket. I removed the hot bell, spread some corn meal on the stone, plopped the ball on it, and covered with the bell. After 20 minutes the temp was reduced to 450, and 10 minutes later I removed the bell. 10 minutes later, the inside was 205 and I pulled it from the oven.

The loaf was 3-4 times its original size, had a hard, crispy crust, and many more of the 1/4-3/8" holes. After 10 hours, the crust is still crispy. The taste of the two loaves seem equivalent to my 69 year old palate.

Using this bell is much easier than using a pot and lid, IMHO.

George

I got some unexpected results since posting the previous comments. After baking one loaf in a hot clouch and the other in a cold clouch, I sliced them up and froze them for use as my morning toast. The bread from the hot clouch becomes dry and crisp, with a thick crust.  The bread from the cold clouch comes out of the toaster with a delightful thin, crisp crust, but the crumb comes out soft and chewy even when toasted fairly dark, just the way I like it.

Still learning.

George 

Here is the report on my sourdough rye.  I ended up retarding it in the refrigerator last night till this morning.  I took it out and let it come to room temp.  I decided that I wanted a sorta batard versus a boule so I let it rise in my oval banneton.  It rose nicely over 4 hours.  I tipped it onto the peel to put it in the oven and the loaf deflated a bit.  I was disappointed and I think it happened because it stuck to the banneton.  I had floured it well beforehand and it still did not come out easily.  I slashed it and baked it and did not get too much oven rise.  The bread is wonderful tasting but it is definately a little deflated.  I am disappointed with the end looking results but will keep working at it.  One of the good things about poor looking outcomes is that they still eat very well. Any suggestions on preventing this type of problem?  All suggestions appreciated. 

Rena in Delaware

This has become my daily bread. (though I make it and freeze one loaf)

Yesterday I made this batch into 4 small loaves.

I had to go shopping and left the dough to rise. I took longer than I expected, so 3 hours later I came home to find my dough spreading all over the place! Over the sides of the baking tray I had it on!

I quickly folded it up and left it to rise again. 20 mins later it was pretty big again, si I folded it again and left it for another 20-30mins. I cut it into 4 and let them rest then chaped them. it was like the beasties were having a frenzy. They rose so well!

I then slashed them........and they were good slashes! Nice and deep, Once they were put in the oven, I got a huge oven rise out of them. I dont normally get an oven rise.

They taste delicious!

Is the secret to my success neglect of the dough ;)

That looks awesome........I have made a few rustics over the last few weeks..Good..But hey, if we all would settle for "good" the local market would be the fix..Right?..Serious question..On this particular bread..Is a preferment ....uhhhh, crucial..? Or am I disposing this step in the manner of asking a saumari why he would go through so much" trouble" to have a sword's blade folded 2,ooo times...My 3 earlier loaves, I used a straight build with all ingrediants, to a 18 minute hand knead-trying to keep it "rustic" and rock it in a old school manner-as I "eye" that groovy, shiny $9 gazzilion mixer that sits on my counter ..I keep telling myself..."Mixer....Not...The...Way...They would have..Done..It...Back in the day.."...I am probably going to do the next loaf as per Floydm's rec...As I put my hand to my head and close my eyes...A hazy vision premenses why my loaves don't have that "heaviness" or the sexy air pockets...Thanks in advance, and please feel free to slap my forehead ..I take few things serious...Fly fishing and baking...Different story...

Notes from the counter-top......Over the last 24 hours, I baked 4 loaves of the above rustic....

-Preferment-Added "weight", depth and complexity in texture and taste...Earlier "non" pref's where more "white bread"-albiet, political posture...insert lame smiley icon...Earlier loaves were light in regard to density, taste, and texture..Last loaves had a crust that you could break bad teeth-desired....Interior was euphorically pockted, airy and springy...Summary....Side notes..Attention paid to static temperatures of all dry ingredients and bowls-warrented explanation....My wife is ingrained with Alabama folklore/urban myth that ALL flour,sugar, cereal products MUST be put in a refrigerator to protect "said" items biblical plagues of "weevils",locust,cicada, and the elusive doodle bug....Short-I believe that I was retarding my yeast growth and overall development of my breads by starting with flours that temperature wise was too cool..Also, I listened to the 'Archers of Loaf" this time...Last time..Graham Parsons..I believe the "Archers" inhibited a better baking enviroment.....Today is a pretzal day and a field study on the effects of 1 pound of rising doughs density on a 3 year old stomach...Baby Jack decided to eat ALL that he assisted with.......Floyd.."Seriously"..Thank you...

I used this rustic loaf as a base for some jalapeno cheese bred today. It came out great!

Que bueno! Rustic bread is one of my favorites; you've improved on a very good thing, and I'll be borrowing your idea one of these times.

I tried this recipe yesterday, after great results with the ciabatta recipe in BBA. I was hoping to get something like a ciabatta, but with more whole wheat flour. It was kind of a flop. To wit:

• The crumb was fairly dense, nothing like the open crumb a rustic bread should have.
• The dough was too slack to shape, so the final loaf looked like an oblong pancake.

I used King Arthur AP flour and Bob's Red Mill Whole Wheat. I followed the recipe as given, except that I allowed about an hour extra rise time because the gluten didn't seem to be developing much at all.

Any suggestions as to what may have gone wrong?

Tried the Rustic Bread recipe this weekend.  I scaled it down to one loaf.  It works pretty much as described.  Mixing preferment into dough is quite a bit of work, so is first folding - the dough is much to soft and sticky at this point.  Second folding is much easier.  I messed up a bit with oven temperature - I should've remembered to turn it down a notch, so the top is a bit too dark for my taste.  The bread turned out quite nice, although I'd put more salt next time.  Also, you absolutely need a good bread knife for this one.

Well, isn't that a loverly loaf? I followed the formula just as is, using rye flour instead of whole wheat. For the steam I tried a method I saw on a video on this site: throw in a cup of hot water and shut the oven door quickly to trap it. A few minutes later I threw in another 1/4 cup of water, though not sure if that had any effect.

As others have experienced, the dough was very sticky and damp the after mixing the pre-ferment in. I decided that using a spatula rather than my hands is better for transferring the dough from vessel to vessel. Love love love the results!

[click photos for larger versions of them]

There are things you do because they feel right & they may make no sense & they may make no money & it may be the real reason we are here: to love each other & to eat each other's cooking & say it was good.—Brian Andreas

It's my try

http://svetilnik-m.livejournal.com/64662.html

http://svetilnik-m.livejournal.com/70250.html

Thank you

I'm relatively new to baking, not in general, but just bread. This recipe worked out really well for me. I was so proud that my loaves turned out looking so beautiful!

The recipe is great!!  Is there a way to double the preferment and "feed" it (like a sourdough starter) to cut the preferment time?  Thank you in advance ...

Well I had nothing better to do this cold winter weekend than to take a stab at some bread.  I've been baking bread for many years but have never tried a rustic recipe.  I watched some You Tube videos and read some of the blogs on this site and got motivated.

I don't have a cloche, but I do have an old Romertopf clay baker.  I baked one loaf on a baking sheet and one loaf in my Romertopf after soaking it in water (the clay baker not the loaf!)  I also used King Arthur white whole wheat flour, so it isn't as dark a bread as some of the photos.

I don't have a classic instant read thermometer so I used by continuous-reading digital meat thermometer that has a wire that leads to the base that sits outside of the oven so that I always know the temp.  It worked great!

Thanks for the recipe--I'll try it again with some added goodies next time.