The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Yeast Water Hamburger Buns with Cinnamon Roll Same Dough Kicker

dabrownman's picture

Yeast Water Hamburger Buns with Cinnamon Roll Same Dough Kicker

I've been searching for a a nice sesame and poppy seeded hamburger bun that would stand up to our monthly, stacked,  piled high burger by not falling apart while still having a soft moist crumb that toasted up well.  I took Sylvia's bun recipe for a starting point and converted it to YW from commercial yeast.  Then we thought we would make some retarded cinnamon rolls out of the same dough since it seemed like the thing to do and a nice fit. 

The YW levain was strong after the 2nd build at at the 8 hour mark.  Right after the 3rd build I refrigerated it overnight.  The YW levain was stronger than we thought and it tripled in volume in the fridge.  Amazing beasts they are!

The next morning we mixed everything together in the KA, it is a sticky wet 77% hydration dough and then developed and fermented the dough doing S & F's on a floured work surface which cuts the stickiness and makes the dough managable at the end of the S & F's at 68% hydration.  It was 85 F in the kitchen when we got to the point of splitting off the 2 hamburger buns from the rest of the dough.   The buns were raised on the counter in the  4" ramekins they would be baked in - eventually.  The steamed mini oven at 400 F to start was perfect for them.  There is a formula and method to follow the pictures.  They ending up being just what we wanted.  The seeded Buns tasted great, didn't fall apart and toasted well.  The fix'ins included; wedge sweet and regular potato fries, caramelized onions and mushrooms, baked BBW beans, roasted poblano pepper, tomato and lettuce.  Why no bacon ?

Coat that Pyrex with non stick spray first or you will be sorry !

The remainder of the dough was rolled out to accept the filling and then rolled up from the short side to make a log that was sliced into 12 pieces.  The rolls were placed into a 9x13 Pyrex baking dish and placed into the fridge for an 18 hour rise.  I expected them to double and they did at least that - no worries.  Baked them off at 350 F straight out of the fridge with some butter smeared on top before they went into the oven.  When they were nice and browned, out they came to receive a nice cream cheese icing to gild the lily.  They were delicious - the best ever.  Now the same dough makes hamburger buns too.  A 2'fer.

Yeast Water Hamburger Buns and Cinnamon rolls     
YW StarterBuild 1Build 2 Build 3Total%
Yeast Water50252510018.18%
Soft White0050509.09%
Starter %   
Levain % of Total 19.43%   
Dough Flour %   
Bread Flour32559.09%   
Soft White Wheat 10018.18%   
Dough Flour42577.27%   
Dough Hydration57.65%    
Add - Ins     
Mashed Potato7012.73%   
Milk Powder203.64%   
Add in Total25546.36%   
Total Flour550    
Total Water345    
T. Dough Hydrat.62.73%    
Hydration w/ Adds77.28%    
Total Weight1,158    
Bench Flour for S & F's70
Hydration w/ S&F Flour68.83%



 The YW levain is built over 3 stages  the first 2 stages are 4 hours each.  After the third stage is added at the 8 hour mark the levain is refrigerated overnight.  It will triple in volume while in the fridge.

 In the morning mix the rest of the ingredients with the levain in the mixing bowl.  Knead with a dough hook on KA 2 for 8 minutes.  Then increase speed to KA 3 for 2 minutes.  move to a plastic covered, oiled bowl.  Do 6 S & Fs at 15 minute intervals on a floured work surface returning the dough each time to a plastic covered bowl to rest.   This wet dough will firm up nicely.  Let rest on the counter for 1 hour after the last S&F.

 At this point I cut off enough dough to make 2 hamburger buns in4”ramekins.  These were allowed to rise on the counter until doubled in size.  A milk, water and egg yolk glaze was brushed on top and sesame and poppy seeds were sprinkled on.  They were then baked in a 400 F steamed mini oven for 10 minutes. The steam was then removed and the oven temperature turned down to 350 F convection this time.  After 5 minutes the ramekins were turned 180 degrees and baked another 5 minutes.  The buns were then removed from the ramekins and finished baking in 5 more minutes turning 180 degrees at the 2 and half minute mark.  The buns were then allowed to cool on a wire rack.

 The remainder of the dough was rolled out to ¼” thick rectangle and brushed with soft butter.  The filling was then added and the dough rolled up from the wide end.  


 ¼ C each brown and white sugar

¼ C each dried apples, apricots, cranberries and raisins reconstituted in 1 T each of Bourbon and water.

¼ tsp each of allspice and cloves

1 tsp each nutmeg and cinnamon

1/2 C each chopped walnuts and chopped chocolate chips.

After rolling, the dough log was cut into 12 equal pieces and placed into a 9”x13” Pyrex baking pan, covered with plastic and put into the fridge to retard overnight.  It should double in volume overnight.  Remove from fridge and brush tops with soft butter.

 Bake off straight from the fridge at 350 F until nicely browned.  Spread cream cheese frosting on top


8 oz powdered sugar

4 oz each cream cheese and softened butter

½ tsp of vanilla.

 Mix everything together with a hand blender and spread on top of the warm cinnamon rolls.


isand66's picture

I think I just gained 10 pounds reading your post!

Great job.  I love your idea of baking the hamburger buns in the ramakins and your dinner looks amazing.



dabrownman's picture

I actually cut the 2 buns in 3rds since I made 3 burgers and needed a bun for the 3rd.  Added a picture of this hamburger featuring the meat, onions, mushrooms and cheese - just for you and Syd. 

isand66's picture

If the burger is nice and rare.....I'm there!

dabrownman's picture

were marinated in some dark mushroom soy sauce, worchestshire sauce and a little dry sake.  Right before they went on the grill they were sprinkled with a little pepper, garlic powder, onion powder, smoked paprika, garam masala and some olive oil to make oit all stick.  Medium rare they were as rare would make the girls go red on the outside.

Syd's picture

Very nice baking dabrownman.  Yeast water is something I have been wanting to try for a long time.  Both your buns and your meal look very enticing.  

All the best,


dabrownman's picture

I really like YW for any leavening that doesn't require a SD taste.  It makes the most soft and moist crumb in every bread I have tried it in.  It even adds an extra boost in height and moistness in SD breads where I have used both kinds of starters together.  It doesn't take away from the SD taste at all.

I have a lot of fun wih it and I think you would too.

FlourChild's picture

Wow, those look delicious!  The bourbon-soaked fruit with chocolate and nuts sounds like a very tasty filling for your rolls, yum! 

Love your notes on the neutral flavor and raising benefits of yeast water- thanks!

dabrownman's picture

glad we found a good hamburger bun recipe that can also be used for something else.  Next time we will do half buns and half cinnamon rolls and use some cream instead of milk powder and water.  YW crumb is always as moist as it can be and sometimes the spring can be explosive as in Japanese White Sandwich Bread.

I use the same filling and frosting for my banana bread too and make it into a 9 x 13 Banana Nut Cake instead.

Thanks for you comments and you are right - the cinnamon rolls were delicious but alas, are now gone :-( 

isand66's picture

Step 1 for YYW DA Hamburger Buns has begun!

I don't have time to refresh every 4 hours per your instructions, so I will refrigerate tonight and tomorrow night do build #2.

Hopefully in a few days I will have something that resembles a hamburger bun!

dabrownman's picture

dump in all 3 builds at once, let it double on tehe counter +- 8 hours or so, then refrigerate it.  It will hit the triple mark in the fridge overnight and be ready in the morning once it warms up.

Make them thin about a half inch, they can be explosive.  If you let them double and then bake,  you will get great bun that you might have to cut the middle out of because it got to high :-)

Good bun luck!

isand66's picture

I guess I will double it up tonight and let it sit in the fridge overnight and be ready to mix the dough the next evening.

I will keep you posted.


isand66's picture

I just screwed up my starter by adding too much flour by mistake.

I am going to start it over tonight and just add all 3 builds together and let it sit overnight.

Stay tuned!

dabrownman's picture

add some water to thin it out if you have the YW it was supposed to have in the final starter.  YW doesn't know the difference, but don't try to fool it with strobe lights and fancy footwork - they might violent :-).  You like those big starters right?

isand66's picture

The problem is I ended up throwing out some of the extra flour I added so now I have no idea how much is in it.

Easier to just start again tonight...

I may save the screw-up and see what happens later with it.
I have another boring bread resting on my cutting least boring by my and your standards :)

Will post about that one in a couple of days....used some maple raspberry syrup and some barley flour, white rye, WW, and grape flour.

I want to try and use one of my wife's Bundt pans so we will see how that turns out.

If you don't see a post later this week you can suspect a disaster....

dabrownman's picture

I put my 200 g YW levain in the fridge earlier today after we added the 3rd build (all flour) at the 8 hour mark.  It had more than doubled already.  Can't decide what to do with it so will dig deep in the hemp and come up with something by tomorrow, maybe something plain like white sandwich loaf - you know the usual :-)  We do have a surprize I picked up yesterday though.

isand66's picture

I can't wait to see your surprise....plain white sandwich loaf?  I will believe it when I see it :)

Tonight I will mix the dough for the YW hamburger buns....hopefully my YW starter will have enough giddy-up to cross the finish line.


isand66's picture

That must have been a different DA....I can't believe you could control yourself and not add some hemp seeds or other add ins!

dabrownman's picture

You are right of course.  I soon went way off the farm and the next YW bread (that was named for teketeke) is a little more different than the first one - but just as nice.

I'm thinking about making this one again but subbing some nice Vietnamese jasmine green tea for the orange juice. Shaio-Ping uses green tea once in a while and thought it would be nice.  Might make some other changes though :-)

isand66's picture

That looks like a real nice bake.  I shall have to check that one out for next time.

My dough is resting in its container right now....I'm going to let it rest in the fridge and bake tomorrow night.

Very wet dough so I am doing quite a few S&F's.

Have my other dough rising in a bundt pan.  I am curious to see how that comes out in a couple of hours.

dabrownman's picture

as I do and can figure out how and where best to use it.  Good luck - the bundt pan sounds appropriate but, unlike your wife, we have one that has to fit all sizes and make do for all occasions.  We used for a combo Polish babka with Russian influences not long ago that came out very nice.

Can't wait to see your post.

isand66's picture

Not so sure the Bundt pan idea is going to work.  I didn't use enough dough to fill the pan.  It is not going to have the desired effect.

dabrownman's picture

in volume before you bake.  It should then explode in the oven and fill the pan nicely.  With a white bread you get some impressive spring with YW.

isand66's picture

I posted my bundt pan loaf....this is not the one I used the YW in.

That will be baked tonight as rolls.

The dough seems a lot higher in hydration than it should be.

I wonder if I added the wrong amount of something.

Stupid question....your measurements are in grams right?  I am 99% sure they are but you never know :)

The WYW mistake starter I made I couldn't make myself throw it out and I left it out on the counter to rise for the hell of it and it certainly is a lively one.  I stuck it back in the fridge and I can't decide if i will use it or not since I'm not sure of the % of flour and water actually in it.