March 14, 2022 - 1:46pm
Roux'd Awakening @ pi - 2
Whilst Tangzhonging flour for last Saturday evening’s 50% ww pizza doughs, it occurred to me that they will take a hydration hit from the water evaporating out of that there saucepan. So I weighed the finished tz product and added the amount of vaporized H2O back to the dough at mixing. Made for a couple of fine and tender-crusted pies.
But I wonder: Do tz aficionados compensate for that water loss? It never occurred to me before when tz-ing flours for 100% ww pan breads.
Tom
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I compensate for evaporation on tangzhong and scalds.
Using scalds lets you crank up hydration because a bunch of moisture gets trapped in the gelatinized flour. If you are implementing a new scald without increasing overall hydration, you have lots of room to play with.
I imagine recipes specifying a scald/tangzhong will be based on what achieves the desired outcome after any evaporation has taken place. And if you are adapting from a recipe that doesn't have one, then the optimal hydration will be different anyway. Are you using a recipe that you also use for a tangzhong pan loaf?
I honestly do not compensate for any water/milk loss during the cooking of the tangzhong.
Benny
Thanks Everybody. Seems there's no real consensus, so let the experimentation continue.
For the record, our current pizze are based on FWSY Overnight Pizza with Poolish. In our 50% ww version, all the AP goes into the poolish. Fresh milled wholegrains have been mostly durum lately.
Significantly wholegrain pizza doughs can be hard on the teeth. Tangzhong seems to ameliorate that, but that provisional conclusion requires more replication than this anecdotal report. More to come.
Tom
If it's chewiness, I would put all the whole grains into the most fermented / most time for hydration to soak in step ie the poolish.
PJ Hamel at King Arthur Baking tested tangzhong in KAB's Classic 100% Whole Wheat Bread. She added an additional 2 Tbsp of water to compensate for the liquid tied up in the TZ. Other recipes on KAB's site that are all white flour do not appear to compensate. Maybe it matters more with whole grain?
After reading that KAB blog post and TFL member MiniOven's practice of compensating on scalds led me to include the compensation when using these techniques.
Ah that is a different question than I answered! As I was developing my formula for the 100% WW sourdough Hokkaido milk bread I did gradually increase the hydration of the dough because of the bran in the WW.
Thanks for that KA reference. PJ reports Tz better promotes shelf-life than initial crumb quality. Shelf-life is obviously not an issue with pizza. But it can be for Hot Cross Buns like these 50% ww's just out the oven (too hot to decorate yet).
This is a dry run 🤔 for the 'real' HCB season coming up in a month. Tz those? It could happen!
Tom
There's also a post at KAB on using TZ in HCB, if you haven't seen it already.
Thanks for the link @alcophile
I never intentionally compensated for what evaporates out of the Tz and really only use it for rolls as much for softness as keeping quality.You win the prize for the first pizza crust I have ever heard of that Tz was used in. I confess to not liking the cotton like crumb in anything larger than a roll. I can highly recommend Hamelman's recipe from Bread for hot cross buns it is a traditional version but very good. The crossing paste is made like Tz and piped on before baking. Much better than the all too common cinnamon roll icing drizzled on.
Don
Whoa @Our Crumb, my thoughts have been turning to hot cross buns and I have been thinking exactly the same, as last year's batch were nice, but lost their softness too quickly for my wife and I to eat them. In fact I had made my mind up to try it, now I definitely will.
I added a tangzhong to some sweet buns and increased hydration for similar reasons.
https://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/70055/regent-buns-citrusy-riff-chelsea-buns
I’ve just posted my take on Hot Cross Buns here in my blog post. They are Sourdough HXB but all whole wheat. My first try at this formula I’m developing. These use a tangzhong and a stiff sweet levain to avoid sourness.
Benny