I've maintained my 100%-hydration wheat starter for years, but have only now followed Stanley Ginsberg's instructions and created what he calls in The Rye Baker a "rye sour culture." I well understand that the two grains are different enough that I can't simply assume that the process I've been using for the wheat starter will also work for its rye sister. Anyway, I have a couple of questions that I don't find answered by Ginsberg.
- He says that once one has done the (weekly) replenishing (100% flour, 100% water, and 10% culture), one should allow it to ferment at room temperature overnight and triple in volume, and that only then should one pop it into the fridge. This I find really surprising based on my (again possibly non-applicable) experience with the wheat starter. My practice has been to take it out of the fridge maybe 60 or 90 min before replenishing and keep it out for a further 60 or 75 min after feeding, but then to refrigerate it before it gets any more carried away. What has worked in the rye department for all of you people?
- He says that when it does go into the fridge, it should be in an airtight container. This too I find a bit surprising. I use Weck jars without either the rubber gaskets or the metal clips, thus there is a very small (but I guess nonzero) amount of airflow. And at least with the wheat starter, I'd be concerned about build up of CO2 in the headspace—even if it didn't explode (unlikely), mightn't the increased pressure and the change in chemical composition somehow harm, or at least deter, my beloved microbes? On the other hand, if it has tripled in volume, then there may not be much more production of CO2 to happen.
I must admit that I wouldn't be too surprised to learn for both of these questions that the consensus of those with experience was "Yeah, it doesn't really matter that much." Regardless, I'd appreciate your guidance.
All I know is that my rye sours seem to take twice as long as Ginsberg says to mature.
TomP
So essentially an entire day at room temperature? And then you refrigerate it?
Usually that's about right. Then I use the sour in the recipe.
Hmmm. Thanks.
I'm talking about creating a sour once the rye starter has been created. We might have been thinking about different things.
I created my rye sour culture ("Vaal"; if you like Star Trek, you'll understand the reference) using Ginsberg's instructions. I maintained the culture using his instructions for a few years. I never really had it triple in volume, just double. A couple years ago, I started feeding it with some organic whole rye flour from a Serbian grocer because it was cheaper than mail order. I also used some Bay State Milling dark rye (Austrian R2500 equivalent) a few times. Around this time, I noticed that the yeast was more sluggish than before. I started using a refresh temperature of 26 °C to get a better rise. I also have switched to back to Breadtopia whole rye. My culture still seems a little sluggish.
I now refresh the starter at 80–90% hydration on the recommendation of Hamelman and Dietmar Kappl at Homebaking.at and I feed at 1:3 culture/flour. I find it matures in ≈8 h at 26 °C. If I'm not baking, sometimes I'll refrigerate it after a few hours because I know I'll be feeding it again before I bake. I use a 4 oz Ball jelly jar for storage and close the lid almost tight. I doubt a lot of air transfer occurs.
King Arthur Baking has instructions for a rye sour culture and the refresh is at 1:1:1 for 12 h at 70 °F.
First I had to watch that disc - had to now - but it wasn't great - Is give it a 7 - anyway.
A starter is made of - and I emphasize - local flora. If ya know what local is there shouldn't be a question. Basically - you get what you get. Concentrations are all over the place from what I can see (no testing = ???). And I gotta get back to Star Trek. Enjoy!
Yes, I have tried different conditions for starter maintenance. I settled on the current regimen based on comments I have seen here and from the Homebaking website. I do test the culture with pH strips and find that it is pH 3.5–4.0. I tried TTA titrations a couple of times but found the phenolphthalein endpoint was challenging with the darker rye flour.
Do you have any other suggestions for tests to perform to assess the performance of the rye sour culture? I would especially appreciate tests for the yeast raising power and tips for improving said raising power. Thanks!
Time. Enjoy!