The Fresh Loaf

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Inside the Jewish bakery - Bagels, Day One...

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

Inside the Jewish bakery - Bagels, Day One...

The day-one workflow is following the written formula pretty well.

1. After ten minutes in the Bosch bowl at speed 1 the dough was coming together but still kind of rough and not elastic at all.

2. To not overheat the dough I let it rest for ten minutes.

3. Then mix five more minutes of speed # 2. Now the dough had some elasticity. I am thinking I could have developed it even more. However, My thinking is there is plenty of time in the cold ferment to develop the dough fully.

4. A few hand-kneads on the bench and the dough ball she looks nice! 

5. the dough is weighed and separated into "equal" length and diameter ropes

6. Rest for 20 minutes and shape.

7. Put to bed in the cooler. 

 

 

 

gavinc's picture
gavinc

So far so good. I've made Hamelman's bagel version and loved them. What will you use in the boiling solution?

Watching with interest.

Cheers,

Gavin.

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

boiling in malt syrup. two Tbs. in 4 quarts of water. I am going to add a tsp of baking soda along with the malt syrup.

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

The prep station

1. bring the water & Malt syrup to a boil

2. At the same time preheat the oven to 550F

3. Add a 1/2 tsp baking soda to the boiling water bath

4. begin plunging the bagels into the bath. (about 20 seconds on each side) until they float.

 

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

These were the first batch out of the oven. Shaping aside not too bad at all. The second six. I decided to gently stretch out a bit. Mistake. Not sure if I degassed them or if I went too big.

 

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...
The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

first, bake, apart. This way, I can make the adjustments, and do Norm and Stan proud! I will start. The glaring shortcoming I see is the need for more development. I mentioned this right away. I should have followed my gut and mixed the raw dough for a few more minutes. The crumb looks a bit underdeveloped. What else should I tweak? I want to strike while the iron is hot. I gave all but two of this first batch away. Tonight bake #2 will commence! Thanks for any and all help. Be brutal, I can take any and all criticism meant to improve my results! Again thank you all so much!

mariana's picture
mariana

This is not brutal and not even criticism, because your bagels are beautiful and amazing and many people like and prefer that style best.

The most outstanding feature of NY style bagels is their chewiness and tight crumb. Everything is done to increase it. You can adjust your shaping style a bit to get closer to that goal by twisting the strand as you roll it out and pinch its end together. See the detail here, starting at 4:42, please.

 

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

Thank you for sharing! I actually saw a video where a commercial guy mentioned this technique. He said they stopped using it a few years ago. As luck would have it I have the perfect tool for that shaping technique! I will give it a try since at this point in the journey speed is a none issue. Thank you for the complement and for the video. Both helpful! 

Econprof's picture
Econprof

Many people argue that the ones with large holes are exactly right. They might not be as good for sandwiches but they are crunchier. I try to make mine that way, not that I am a bagel expert. 

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

I want to keep that crunchiness while achieving a crumb that is more uniform. Thanks for posting!

 

Econprof's picture
Econprof

It might have sounded like I meant a bagel should have an open crumb :p I meant the hole in the center of the bagel, as with your second batch. Those look really good to me.

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

To me, the second batch looks like the hole is too big, and not enough oven springs. 

 Off-topic. You may or may not know that I manage an NYU faculty housing building. Well, one of my tenants is an economics professor. His last name is Economides. I always have found that to be amusing. Smile...

Econprof's picture
Econprof

Somewhere in the middle of the two.

That is funny. I hadn’t heard of him (different field) but seems like he’s a very well known scholar. 

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

I am on a bagel roll! These will get an extra 4 hrs. in the cooler. 

 

clazar123's picture
clazar123

I wanted to reach in and grab one!. Great write-up. Nothing technical to contribute as I never did bagels. I've been too intimidated by the lye but with Stan's-there is no lye so no excuse, anymore!

I like the larger rings- more crust to enjoy. Bagels are not my first choice for sandwiches-I'd rather have a schmear, butter and cinnamon, cheese, jam, etc. 

Thanks!

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

Hi, Clazar.

Correct, you have no excuse whatsoever! The "Inside the Jewish bakery" formula is replicable with no specialized equipment or advanced skill. While by no means do I fancy myself an expert, I am always happy to share my first-hand anecdotal experience. Please don't hesitate to ask if any questions come up. Smile...

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

With the help of Marianna's posted shaping video, I was able to achieve a big improvement in the final product. In fact, I will go out on a limb and call them perfect! Now if I can figure out how to replicate the square hole in the middle, that can be my trademark! A short video of the complete day 2 of 2 workflows will follow later. Fyi, day 2 of 2 is about forty minutes from refrigerator to cooling rack! No bad at all! 

 

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

I absolutely knew I was going to start another batch of bagels today. However, in my haste to keep my workstation neat and tidy, I poured out the boiling solution again. I don't know what the price is where you live, but that small jar of organic barley malt is high in NYC! Grrr. 

 Edited to add.

 Who is up for an NYC water bagel community bake? While posting the recipe from Inside the Jewish bakery verbatim would require permission. I don't think finding a formula comparable in the public domain would be a problem. It is a pretty standard formula. LET'S DO THIS TEAM! 

Edited to add.

Danyo...

Maybe Norm posted his formula in public on the board? 

mariana's picture
mariana

They look like a masterpiece to me. Like you you graduated from a famous bagel school and are now an accomplished bagel baker.

Well done! Very well done.💖💖💖

👍👍👍

Econprof's picture
Econprof

Although what I'd really like is a recipe for a pumpernickel bagel that involves a rye sour. I can't seem to find one anywhere, although I know that they exist and are supposed to be the best.

Econprof's picture
Econprof

The new bagels look beautiful!

Benito's picture
Benito

They look amazing Will, well done.  I’d love a bagel right now!

Benny

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

The bagels were surprisingly easy! Of course, a well-written replicable formula is always half the battle. That being said, Cheers to Mr. Ginsberg, and Mr. Berg (RIP) 

I have another dozen bagels in the cooler for tomorrow morning. After this batch, my next performance will be the mastery of the less famous, but very well-known in New York City, second cousin to the bagel, The "Białystok"! Coming to you directly from the northeastern Polish town of the same name, by way of the L.E.S. New York City!

Photo because I must brag! That's just me, too old to change!