The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Troubleshooting - Crumb Shots

halfpastsixbakes's picture
halfpastsixbakes

Troubleshooting - Crumb Shots

 hi everyone, new to the forum and about 23 loaves into the sourdough journey.

 

I struggled with underproofing in the beginning, and now I'm better at gauging when the BF is done. 

I live in the tropical climate, high humidity and around room temp of 27-29 deg. 
 I did an experiment with 20% starter, 75% hydration, 90% bread flour 10% atta whole wheat flour,  to see the difference between 40% and 50% increase during BF. 

The loaf with seed (left): 40% bulk

BF : 3 hours 25 mins

Plain: 50% bulk

BF: 4 hours 

Both had a 20 min rest after preshaping and final shaping (+40 mins) then to the fridge.  They had a 19 hour-ish cold retard in the fridge.

I have question: why do I keep getting a big bubble in the middle? I shouldn’t be under proofing already.  Could it be overproofed in the fridge, or because I didn't score well?

I tried all the tricks I know - to tap tap, burst all the bubbles I can see already. 

I shape it via the “envelope” then roll into a ball.

What I am after are more evenly distributed with pockets of larger crumbs throughout.

any insights by the more experienced bakers would be appreciated.

ciabatta's picture
ciabatta

Maybe just hyperactivity due to high temps.  have you tried to use cooler water for you dough mix and achieve a certain dough temperature? 40-50% increase during bulk is on the higher end of the spectrum. See what happens if you do 20%.  

 

halfpastsixbakes's picture
halfpastsixbakes

I had underproofed several of my earlier bakes that I am so worried now. I also do the Poke Test and usually pretty good at recognizing now.  In fact a fellow country baker suggested that my crumb looks underproofed.  I'm so confused now, because I had a "sidekick" dough which I took a piece from the beginning to help me gauge the doneness.

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

More detal would be nice. How are you shaping after the rise. Detail from bowl to proof shaping with apoximate resting times.  There is a trick to do just the right amount of degassing to set up the crumb for what you desire.

The crumb above looks great for baguettes so carefully take notes on what you are doing before changing anything.

halfpastsixbakes's picture
halfpastsixbakes

thanks mini oven. 

The detailed timings:

autolyse: 30 mins

add starter and rest 30 mins

add salt and rest 30 mins

stretch and fold then rest 30 mins

lamination then rest 30 mins

coil fold then rest 30 mins

cold fold then rest 30 mins

NOTE: I took a sidekick dough after adding starter to help me gauge my BF.

at 3 hours 25 mins, it reached around 40% and at 4 hours, it reached 50%.

once it reached desired BF %, i preshaped loosely, tuck four sides into the center, then roll into a ball. Rest 20 mins.

Final shaping, I did the envelope: pull the bottom toward the center, left toward the center, right toward the center and roll. Pinched the seams closed, then roll into a boule.  

Proofing was done in identical ikea bowls lined with tea towel.  

Into a 3-4 deg fridge (given throughout the day the fridge was open and closed), retard for about 19ish hours. 

Baked in cold closed vessels, preheated oven 230deg for 20 mins lid on, 210deg for 20 mins lid on, 200 deg for 15 mins lid off to brown.

P/S I always use cold vessels, preheated oven method. I had great springs before, so prefer not to focus on the baking method for now :)

PPS: I am actually happy with the crumbs but I wish I could avoid big bubbles in 1 spot and have more evenly distributed of small and medium size lacy crumb.

 

After thought : could it ever be the starter? my starter is definitely active, but not as active as some I have seen, where they can go 1:7:7 in 12 hours. Mine doubles with 1:2:2 in 10-11ish hours.  

 

halfpastsixbakes's picture
halfpastsixbakes

thanks mini oven. 

The detailed timings:

autolyse: 30 mins

add starter and rest 30 mins

add salt and rest 30 mins

stretch and fold then rest 30 mins

lamination then rest 30 mins

coil fold then rest 30 mins

cold fold then rest 30 mins

NOTE: I took a sidekick dough after adding starter to help me gauge my BF.

at 3 hours 25 mins, it reached around 40% and at 4 hours, it reached 50%.

once it reached desired BF %, i preshaped loosely, tuck four sides into the center, then roll into a ball. Rest 20 mins.

Final shaping, I did the envelope: pull the bottom toward the center, left toward the center, right toward the center and roll. Pinched the seams closed, then roll into a boule.  

Proofing was done in identical ikea bowls lined with tea towel.  

Into a 3-4 deg fridge (given throughout the day the fridge was open and closed), retard for about 19ish hours. 

Baked in cold closed vessels, preheated oven 230deg for 20 mins lid on, 210deg for 20 mins lid on, 200 deg for 15 mins lid off to brown.

P/S I always use cold vessels, preheated oven method. I had great springs before, so prefer not to focus on the baking method for now :)

PPS: I am actually happy with the crumbs but I wish I could avoid big bubbles in 1 spot and have more evenly distributed of small and medium size lacy crumb.

 

After thought : could it ever be the starter? my starter is definitely active, but not as active as some I have seen, where they can go 1:7:7 in 12 hours. Mine doubles with 1:2:2 in 10-11ish hours.  

 

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

"Final shaping, I did the envelope: pull the bottom toward the center, left toward the center, right toward the center and roll. Pinched the seams closed, then roll into a boule."

Try something else instead of an envelope fold. Or stretch the dough more going past the center clear to the other side.   Or just roll or stretch out the dough and roll up without folding.  

halfpastsixbakes's picture
halfpastsixbakes

Thank you!