Newbie help please! Under or over-proofed?
First, I want to thank everyone here - I have done a ton of reading as I start my sourdough journey and there is so much helpful information here! I am currently on my 4th sourdough loaf, and I'm trying to figure our if I've over-proofed or under-proofed it. Or perhaps over-fermented (is that a thing)? I'm using the Ken Forkish Overnight country brown recipe (using about 30% KAF sprouted whole wheat flour instead of regular whole wheat), and it's my second time making it. While the first time I did the crumb was dense, this time it was even more so. I have also made his overnight blonde, which is all AP flour, and the crumb looked much better (at least to my novice eyes!). I also noticed that I am not getting much oven spring from the sprouted wheat flour.
I live in Southern California, and it's been quite warm here - the house is usually around 77 during the day, and 73 at night. Forkish specifies a bulk ferment overnight at room temp (12-15 hours) then shaping and proofing for 4 hours before baking, but assumes a temp of 70 degrees, which is much cooler than my current conditions. During BF he says the bread should be 2.5-3 times the volume, and I've noticed mine is more like 4-5 times larger. I have a really vigorous starter (it triples in 5-6 hours even when fed at 1:2:2 ratio) so I'm wondering if it's over-fermenting, which maybe in turn leads to over-proofing? I will say that the bread stuck to the proofing basket this bake so I really had to pull it out :-(. When I did it spread more than I think it should have. The taste is wonderful, and the crust is crisp-chewy but I feel like the crumb needs to be less dense. If I'm not providing enough info please let me know and I can specify whatever is needed. Thank you in advance for your help!
At a glance I would say somewhat underproofed, but after reading, I think it's more likely that you just deflated your loaf a fair amount while pulling it out of the basket :) Popping all the big bubbles, leading to a denser crumb
Due to your warmer climate, I would recommend cutting the bulk short (shaping once it reaching 2-3x volume, however long that takes) and then either proofing overnight in the fridge, or simply after another 3 hours or so at room temp.
Thank you Amara! I did do the poke test before I dumped it out, and it sprang back a little, but left a little indentation as well, if that helps.
Also, I'm using a Dutch Oven to cook it in, but I'm noticing the bottom crust gets so dark while the rest is just right. I'm going to try moving it up a rack (it's on the middle rack right now) but I'm worried about the top getting too dark! Any other tips to try to get the bottom to stay lighter? I bough a round SilPat that I think I'll try also.
To lighten the bottom crust you can try a double layer of parchment paper under the dough.
Another idea is a sheet below the Dutch oven. On a rack below your Dutch oven place a cookie sheet to shield your Dutch oven from direct heat. I would consider this instead of baking on a higher rack because you’re right, the top will over brown. Another thing you could try is to put the dutch oven on a broiling rack, the bottom of the broiling rack will act as a shield to direct heat while the dutch oven sits on the rack.
Benny
Thank you so much Benny! I'm trying another loaf today and will definitely do this!
PS - your loafs are incredible! I love seeing your new ones pop up on the blog :-)
Ariana, thanks so much for the comments on my bakes. I still have much room for improvement but I guess I’ve come a long way in the past year. Good luck with the next bake.
Oh my goodness your loafs look amazing! And so creative. I guess we all feel like we have lots to learn but honestly your loafs are what I always look forward to seeing on the blog. Good luck with your next bake as well and thanks again for your help!
That is too kind of you Ariana, but thanks. I look forward to your future bakes and growth as a baker.
Benny
I have also been wrestling with KF's O/N Country Brown, and after many a hockey puck have determined that my loaves were over-proofed. It is worse with whole wheat because of the bran cutting the gluten strands, and I had one batch turn into soup during the cold retard. Others have noted that KF really pushes the length the bulk fermentation. I've found if I go for a 2-3X rise (~3.5-4 hrs in my kitchen) before putting it at 4 degrees o/n, shape the next day and let them proof in the banneton (use rice flour to dust the banneton - it's magically unsticky!) at RT until they are a little poofy (~couple hours), then bake.
KPLee, thank you so much! That was incredibly informative. I'm sorry to hear you had so many hockey pucks but truly appreciate you sharing your experience. My daughter has requested his bacon sourdough, so I'm going to try our method with that loaf today, and then will try again with the sprouted wheat next week again. Because he lists a slightly shorter BF for the bacon one last time I had to stay up late to do the stretch and folds, so it makes me happy to hear I can make it earlier (as long as my starter is ready in time!) and then put it in the fridge. If I may ask, does it matter if you shape and then refrigerate, or should I leave it in the BF container and shape in the am, and how does each affect the final loaf?
Thanks for the rice flour tip - I will look for some when I head to the store later this week!
So I refrigerate the bulk fermentation, since that fits my schedule (I usually breadmake at night, after work). But I've seen many people who bulk ferment, shape and then refrigerate, and many who bake the shaped loaves straight out of the refrigerator. The cold loaves are easier to handle and score, and if done right are supposed to give a good oven spring.
But the one time I tried this I had a really under-proofed loaf, which meant I misjudged the bulk fermentation. It turns out for my schedule, it is just as easy to bulk ferment one night, and shape/let proof at RT/bake the next night. I am still learning the nuances of The Dough, so doing a RT proof gives me a second chance to guage where the dough is.
Thank you again! That makes total sense. So even if you under-ferment you'll be able to account for that during the final proof. I don't want to under proof either! I made the dough for his bacon sourdough, just finished the stretch and folds, and it's now fermenting on my counter. I will keep and eye and still it in the fridge once it's tripled!
Thank you again for your help and will report back on how it turned out!