The Fresh Loaf

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Substituting sprouted rye berries for cracked rye berries

mutantspace's picture
mutantspace

Substituting sprouted rye berries for cracked rye berries

thought I’d swap cracked rye berries for sprouted rye berries in a bread I’m making. I was going to use same amount of berries e Celt I’d sprout them rather then crack them. Question is hydration. Is there a difference or being the same weight of berry should they be approximately the same and most importantly will the sprouted berries ferment in the same way or faster/slower ? Thanks 

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

If you were to sprout them and dry them out completely so they're back to being like a hard berry then you needn't worry too much from the weight point of view. How about sprouting, drying then roughly grinding them to approximate cracked rye? As for faster/slower then we're talking about diastatic and non diastatic so it depends on how they're dried. Dry them above a certain temperature then they're non diastatic and you needn't worry about that. Any cooler and they will be diastatic and you will need to take this into account. Since rye already has high enzymatic activity then you rarely see malt being used in rye this way.

mutantspace's picture
mutantspace

Note: just reread original post. I meant to say I want to swap cracked rye berries for sprouted rye berries.

I want to toss sprouts into sponge instead of cracked rye - basically it’s a 10-12 hour ferment with sourdough, seeds, water and honey + cracked rye which I’d be replacing with equal amount of sprouted berries (I usually presoak crack rye separately for longer so they soften up before adding to sponge whereas this time the sprouted berries would be naturally soaked over the few days it takes to activate them). Flour goes in at end of process before short bulk and long proof

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

If you normally pre-soak, and drain, the cracked rye then adding sprouted rye instead, which haven't been dried out again, should be ok when it comes to hydration. Expect small differences here so will still be a good idea to hold back on some of the water which can always be added later if you think the dough needs it.

Now as far as substituting the cracked for sprouted when it comes to fermentation, now it is malted grain this would probably alter things. Malt is normally added as a flour but you will be adding malted wholegrains so just how much of this diastatic activity will change things I don't know. Watch the dough!

mutantspace's picture
mutantspace

Why is it malted grain? I’m just hydrating berries to sprout them? I thought you had to dehydrate sprouted grains to make them?

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

Is sprouting. When you make malted flour it's sprouted, dried and ground. But it is the spouting that makes it malted. The process releases sugars locked inside the grain. But because you won't be drying and grinding it into flour before adding it back in i'm not sure how much of an effect this malting will have on the dough.

mutantspace's picture
mutantspace

That’s a big lesson thanks. I was always under impression the sprouts had to be dehydrated or toasted even to make them malted. Always good to learn. And am I right in thinking that malted flour ferments faster due to increased enzyme activity?

Abe's picture
Abe (not verified)

Grains are sprouted to release sugars. This is malting. However, they need to be crushed to further release these sugars. This is called mashing.

So while sprouting is malting it might need a further step of mashing for it to be most effective. I wonder if this translates to bread too. Question is if you just add the whole malted grains as an add-in will it have the same effect as adding them in as a flour? One for the experts I think. Hope someone gets to see this post.

Yes, malted flour increases enzymatic activity. How much when not mashed or ground is another story.

I realise you don't have a definitive answer yet but hope I've shed some light on the matter.

mutantspace's picture
mutantspace

You’ve been very helpful thanks I’ve learnt s lot in a little burst - one of the many joys of this forum 

David R's picture
David R

One reason the malt is dried afterward (I don't know whether it was the original/main reason) is that if you store it damp, it will quickly go bad. (That reason becomes irrelevant if you're baking it right away.) Toasted vs not toasted clearly makes a flavour difference - I've tried beer where they had clearly gone too far with toasting, and the whole thing tasted burnt.

mutantspace's picture
mutantspace

That makes sense - I’ve toasted sprouts for rye bread in the past and loved the flavour might make some more now that we’re on the subject and I’ve recently got access to dehydrator so might give it a go 😀

MTloaf's picture
MTloaf

 I have used sprouted rye as a substitute in Hammelman's 5 grain bread, that calls for chopped rye berries. They are also part of the soaker along with other grains. I chop them with a knife before adding them in. Since they are already soaked You should deduct the water from the formula that would normaly be in the soaked rye chops. 

mutantspace's picture
mutantspace

Perfect thanks