Benefits of stiff starters, stiff levain and liquid starter or levain...

Hi everyone,

I am intrigued....I noticed that in a number of posts when people experienced 'flat' loaves with higher hydration Tartine style breads one recommendation was to try a stiffer starter... So I investigated and found a very interesting post from Debra Wink and Dan Di Muzio...apologies, if you have seen this already....

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/14913/very-liquid-sourdough

I am still digesting this amazing thread but one of the key things so far I have taken away and sorry to Dan and Debra, if I have simplified their amazing contribution too much to make it work for my brain.......

1. use stiff starter fed regularly to get better oven rise especially in high hydration doughs...and I also like the side effect that it will give me less sour (BUT MORE LIFT because of yeast)

2. use a stiff pre-ferment  from a liquid starter,  if I want to focus on more 'sour'" and not oven rise.

3. "If you're making heavily enriched dough that has to ferment a long time (6-24 hours), the firm starter might be your best bet.  There's less danger of a too-high rate of enzyme activity, which could weaken the structure of a long-fermented loaf. "

Now, the 'cynic' in me feels that of course there is no such thing as a 'magic stiff starter' that gives me more oven rise without working harder at my shaping, scoring skills and other variables.....! :D

However, I am intrigued and  I started using a 60% stiff starter (and thank you to Dan Ayo for helping with working out how to get 60% hydration) in Trevor's Tartine Country Style Loaf at 85% hydration.

Photos of first result....I am happy with crumb but oven spring still could be better (but that could have been due to my awful scoring and DO was too small for dough length....)...

Anyway...any thoughts on this and your findings would be  very much appreciated....

Kat