Sourdough panettone help
I tried to make sourdough panettone for the first time today with not the best success. I tried to follow mwilson's perfect panettone formula but wasn't sure of the actual process so I used a google translated version of Iginio Massari's method. I had my starter ready to roll and made the first dough last night and it rose to three times its original volume today. However, when I mixed the second dough today it was very loose. I mixed it in my KA mixer for about 30 minutes from start to finish but it never tightened up. It was more batter like than dough. I started the process of fermentation and folding it every 30 min but it still was loose after an hour, so I tried the mixer again and then it was totally shot. It never recovered from that second mixing.
I still have yet to cut into it and check out the crumb but it definitely didn't fill up the mold all the way and like I said seemed more like batter than a dough. I've watched videos of Roy Shvartzapel and his dough is like a rubber band when he touches it, springs right back. I know those are lofty goals, especially for my first try, but I'm just looking for any insight. I've seen people mention Cresci here but, being a student, I have limited funds and I don't think I have seen it listed for less than $200. I would appreciate any insight or advice anyone has as panettone is one of my favorite things around the holidays and I would love to be able to get a good sourdough one going. Thanks everyone!
In my experience the recipes in Cresci sometimes require some tinkering. Why don't you try Sua's recipe instead? It works like a charm right out of that book, and there's a beatiful write-up of it.
Bread recipes (incl. pannetone) have a wide range of outcomes using different ways to get there. Many breads are not fussy and a delicious outcome is achievable almost no matter what you do. Pannetone, however, is one of those breads that has to have a "perfect storm" of temperature, acidity and gluten type/strength to make a good loaf. It is technically a challenging bread and Wild Yeast's blog is a beautiful writeup of her efforts over time.
I opted, one holiday, to make a more forgiving recipe for a fruited bread that was buttery and delicious. I called it "Pannetoche" because it was adapted from my "go to" brioche recipe. The recipients loved the lovely, buttery,fruited,scented gift bread that was so much less technically challenging during a high stressed, holiday time.
July sounds like a better time to perfect such a challenging recipe. Have some delicious fun!
No need to buy Cresci. It's not that telling.. His newer book Non Solo Zucchero is far more detailed, yet it's only printed in Italian!
From what you describe it sounds like your starter was too strong. All the proteins were degraded!
https://www.dissapore.com/ricette/panettone-iginio-massari/
Cresci has actually been reissued a couple of years ago as a bilingual Italian/English book, somewhat condensed though, compared to the 2000 edition. Of course it is just one of beautful Italian books that has never been available in the US.
I actually tried to follow that recipe in that link but found the translation wasn't the greatest. I refreshed the starter every 4 hours over the course of 12 hours but maybe I need to keep a closer eye on it next time. Is there any way to reliably tell when it's ready other than looking for it to triple in volume (does it float like a more liquid starter does)?
I'm going to give it another shot this weekend but maybe will try the link that suave recommended earlier.
Thanks everyone!!
Thanks for this. I had panettone on my mind to give a try. And then Cooks' Country had a commercial yeasted one and I did that 3 times and kept reading around.
Then I tried the one featured in BBA.
I tried another one I found around also with a pinch of commercial yeast at Weekend Project that was pretty lovely.
Today's bake is from Wild Yeast. I feel like I am summoning up all that is necessary to do one without commercial yeast and I have my eye on Wilson's favorites from Massari.