Refrigerating spelt/rye shaped loafs
Hi all,
I have been a bit of a lurker, having read numerous posts and experimenting with our bread baking over the last 6 months to the point we now have a repeatable process to make 2 loaves of Spelt/Rye sourdough.
We start off with a levain of 1 cup of rye starter straight from the fridge, 500ml of water warmed up to 35C, and 300g of rye flour. We mix this and then leave overnight.
The next morning we add 300g of warmed water, 100g of salted butter, 750gms of white spelt and 24g of salt flakes. Let rise once for a hour, stir dough, let rise for another hour, then add another 50g of spelt flour and shape to go into tins. The bread then rises on top of the coffee machine and I let it bubble out of the tin, that's when I know it's ready. It's now taken by our kids to school and they've accepted eating it every day, which is awesome, no more commercial bread!
The only challenge I have had is trying to incorporate a rise in the fridge. I've been unsuccessful in every attempt, I've tried both shaping into tin and putting straight in the fridge, but I never get the rise to the top of the tin. If I let rise first until it hits the tin, then refrigerate, then it overproofs and deflates in the oven.
I was hoping there would be a way we could refrigerate to allow a little more flexibility as to when we have to bake, as it stands right now we have to be there for a 4 hour window to babysit the process to ensure it rises and cooks successfully.
Any advice is most welcome!
for a half hour or an hour before putting it into the fridge? You might need to do some trial and error problem solving before you can figure out the optimal time to let it rise before putting it in the fridge. Then once you have that figured out, be sure to bake your loaves directly from the fridge. I hope this helps.
Couple thoughts/suggestions... If you're baking the same bread weekly, consider jettisoning the levain build and converting your rye starter to a rye/spelt starter. (I use a 50/50 rye/spelt starter all the time b/c rye is so effective for leavening but I love the flavor & nutrition of the spelt -- I simply mix a giant bag of the two flours and keep it in the fridge for feeding; when I get low, I just mix up another feeder supply.) That way, you can avoid throwing out the discard and save yourself the time and management of the levain build. So, let's assume you ditch the levain build and instead do this: the night before you bake, mix the rye/spelt starter with the rest of your dough ingredients; do 3 (or so) stretch and folds with 30 min. rests (covered on counter or someplace warm-ish); and then pop it in the fridge for an overnight, cold bulk ferment (using the overnight hours for a slow, cold fermentation instead of a levain build). Next morning: take it out of the fridge; divide; pre-shape it (to build structure in the loaf); let it rest on counter 20 min; final shape; pop in tins; rise for 1.5 hours or so; bake.
This will free you up from the levain build step; give you the flavor development of a cold fermentation; no need for that 2x 1-hour rise in the morning; and allow you to have more wiggle room in the morning bake time.
I like the idea of this process, but the only concern I have is the stickiness of spelt flour that makes any stretch and fold virtually impossible without adding additional flour. Would stirring with a wooden spoon be a sufficient alternative?
Typically when I put it in the bread tin, it fills up about 2/5 of the tin and the dough rises to the top, but it's very sticky.
The idea of the s&f is to build gluten structure - it's the functional equivalent of kneading without knocking all the gas out of the dough, so you are left with good structure for chew, with a relatively open crumb. Stirring may get you the gluten structure and if you don't give a hoot about the crumb quality, then stir away. Whatever you prefer and works for you. I never add flour during S&Fs. Here's how: I ferment my dough in a large bowl or bucket and when I do the S&F, I wet my hands with water, shake off the excess drops, and do the S&F -- right there in the bowl. Rinse off my hands and done. Does this help?
So I had a crack at this technique overnight and today. Added all ingredients, stretch and folded 3 times, then placed into fridge.
Took out of fridge in the morning and shaped. Surprised at how easy it is to work with wet dough when its a bit colder, so appreciate the advice there. One thing that caught me by surprise is that the dough did not rise to about the tin lid level until about 8 hours afterwards. I was thinking at one stage that it wasn't going to rise at all, but it eventually did, and so we cooked it around 6 pm this evening. I think I need to add another 50g of flour just to get the shape of the load to match that of a pullman loaf tin and lid as it was just a bit shorter than what we wanted, but this may work a bit better for us time wise by bulk fermenting overnight and then having a slow rise throughout the day while we go to work. I saw no deflation in the oven which is awesome, just need to mess with ingredient quantites to get what we need.
I'll post some pictures of the loaves and crumb once we cut into it after it's cooled.
Hooray for progress! 8 hours seems like a long proof on the counter (versus the fridge). Have you considered whether to increase the overall amount of dough you are making to place in the tin (see dabrownman's reply post)?
I weighed the dough in at about 1.05kg for each loaf, as I always cook 2 loaves. I find that 1.1kg is about the right amount for the tin size I have, so that's why I'm going to play with the flour amounts a little to get it at that.
The rise wasn't just done on the counter, it was in some plastic container covered on top of the coffee machine, which I know is at around 30C. For the first 4-5 hours, I saw absolutely nothing happening and assumed it wasn't going to rise at all. Then I saw some rise and just let it go from there, as if it had woken up or something.
I still think this process might be better for the family balance, get the bulk ferment process the night before, shape in morning, bake at night. The aim is to have kid friendly lunch bread that doesn't interrupt our daily lives and is more nutritious. I'm just surprised at the different behaviour given how active I've observed the rise of the dough when I've had a rye levain overnight on the counter.
Here we gone, one loaf cut, the other uncut.
Dang - for some reason the pics aren't coming through. Also query whether you're incorporating enough starter in the original formula (deducting from the unfermented flour and water on the back end to accommodate). Although less starter = more flavor, this is a sandwich bread for lunch boxes, not the papal visit.... I absolutely love that you are doing this, by the way. I think it's fantastic that you are working so diligently to provide a wholesome lunch.
Hopefully the pic works this time.
Good lookin' sandwich bread, MiLK! Bravo. :)
you are not putting in enough dough in the tin to fill it properly. 2/5th is not enough for white bread much less one with any whole grains in it. IF the dough would rise to the top in the fridge it would be way over proofed and collapse in the heat of the oven. For your recipe I would fill the tin 3/5th full and when the dough s=rised 1/2" above the rim in the center, in the oven it goes expecting an 85% max rise before the heat.
To know exactly what weight of dough fits your tin you need to put a water tight plastic grocery bag in the tin, then weigh the water it takes to fill the tin to the rim. Then divide this water weight by the expected rise of the dough in this case 85%. So if the water weighed 2200 g you divide it by 1.85 and you get 1189 g of dough is required to fill the tin.
The other thing to remember is that the amount of pre-fermented flour in the mix controls how long you need to retard a shaped loaf. I was always having a problem of the dough over proofing in the fridge going for an 18 hour retard. But once I cut the levain down to 10% prefermented flour, from 20%, I could get it to work. The spelt and rye in your mix will make the dough very fast so I would be surprised it you could get 12 hours of retard at 10% pre-fermented flour .
The thing to remember is that of a shaped loaf does over proof in the fridge, you can just reshape it and let it proof on the counter the next morning. It is no different than doing a retarded bulk ferment and then shaping and baking the next mirning - so no big whoop.
You just need to get the amount of dough right and the amount of pre-ferment right for your recipe and the amount of time you want to retard the shaped loaf and all will be well.
Happy baking