Cold Bulk Ferment Schedule
Hi there!
I'm new to bread baking and have been experimenting with sourdough for the last six months or so. The method I've been using, with fairly good success rate for a newbie, is the one laid out for beginners by Maurizio on The Perfect Loaf. https://www.theperfectloaf.com/beginners-sourdough-bread/
I've played around with this a bit, including upping hydration to 90%, adding oat porridge, adding other flavors, changing types of flours and/or %s of flours, replacing water with other liquid, etc. etc..
I'm interested in changing the fermentation schedule and thinking about whether retarding during bulk ferment would yield better results. Mainly, I'd like to get a more open crumb in the final result. But, a few questions come to mind regarding a cold bulk ferment schedule.
1.) I normally do 3 - 5 stretch and folds during room temperature bulk ferment depending on hydration, and end up with a DDT around 75F. This is before shaping and cold proofing overnight in clouches. When bulk fermenting in the fridge, would I still stretch and fold the same way, just with longer resting periods between? And do I do this straight out of the fridge to keep the dough temp low?
2.) How long should the bulk ferment be (at around 40F) as opposed to my usual 5ish hours at room temp?
3.) How long does it typically take for proofing to finish after shaping following a cold bulk ferment? Ambient temp is typically 74F. Do I want FDT to be brought back 75F before baking?
My starter is about 6 months old, very healthy and active, 100% hydration. Originally started with rye flour, now fed only with all purpose.
Thanks for any and all feedback. As I said I'm just starting the learning process, so any information is helpful. The beginner's sourdough post by The Perfect Loaf has been so helpful in my understanding of the process, and it seems like a great formula and method to work off of. I've been sticking to it as my master recipe until I feel like I have a handle on it, then I'd like to branch out more.
Hello klesueur,
I thank you for your posting! I've got the same questions!
I've been using The Perfect Loaf recipe (beginners, country sourdough with less levain, a return to the basics)since last month and got good results.
Last week the room temperature rose about 27-28C/80-82F and the taste of sourdough bread got mild. I like a sour taste and am thinking that a bulk ferment in the fridge might work for getting back the sourness to bread. Here in Japan, from July to Sep the highest temperature is 35-37C/95-98F and adjusting the time schedule for the high room temperature is not easy for me as I am a beginner.
I have the same questions 1) and 2) klesueur posting here.
Thanks for any tips! and again thanks for klesueur!
Ako
the loaf would give you a more open crumb. Maybe post some pictures so we can see what kind of crumb you're getting. Crumb structure is a function of many variables.
For a basic SD loaf, I do 5 sets of stretches during the first two hours of bulk fermentation at 30min intervals. That's usually how long it takes to get my dough well developed, you just have to judge when your dough is strong enough. Then I leave it undisturbed at room temp for 2-3 hours depending on the temperature. I just leave it for long enough so that it has some nice bubbles developing, its probably about doubled. Then I preshape, shape and leave it in the fridge, no more stretches.
I don't think you'll be able to stretch the dough very well once it goes in the fridge, because the dough firms up a lot when it gets cold.
My dough usually stays in the fridge for about 20 hours. I bake straight from the fridge. This has worked for me. I've only been baking SD for 4 months so I'm fairly new at this too :)
I know some people prefer to retard earlier and then shape the dough while its cold and give it a little more time to proof at room temp before baking. I've never tried this.
I don't have a thermometer so i can' t help you with dough temperatures.
Hope that helps :)
with hydration, how and when you handle the dough to develop the gluten with more emphasis on gluten development not whether it is retarded during final proof or bulk ferment. Flavor is affected more by retarding
Thanks for the feedback thus far. I guess I sort of knew that the retarded bulk ferment wouldn't necessarily result in a more open crumb, but that it might change the way in which I handle the dough to result in a different crumb (more or less open). Seems like that's not the case?
I'm typically working with a minimum of 85% hydration these days. I'll try to post some pictures... but you can see examples on my instagram account @cocokatpdx.
Yesterday I used a different approach than my usual method (as described in the beginners' sourdough method from the perfect loaf).
I made a porter hazelnut dough with 10% barley flour, and a hard apple cider dough with dates and 10% millet. Same Both 90% hydration. I did a longer levain ferment because it was cool in the morning, and it seemed like it needed more time. I also wanted to try a much longer autolyse for gluten development.
The schedule:
1. Levain build 8:30 am
2. Autolyse without salt 12:30 pm
3. Mix and start bulk ferment 5:30 pm. Rest one hour.
4. Stretch and Fold x 5, 30 - 45 minute rests, add-ins during fourth S&F
5. Retard 11:00 pm. FDT 76F
Today I am planning on dividing and shaping around 11 AM and bringing to 75-78F before baking.
I am sure I need to work on my handling of the dough... I think I have the stretch and fold down, but I am guessing my shaping needs work. If my crumb is more on the dense side, am I likely overworking it during shaping?
Today I plan to focus on being more deliberate but gentler than I've been in the past... does that make sense?
https://www.instagram.com/cocokatpdx/
the link in my last comment didn't work...
I bulk ferment most of my sourdoughs either in the fridge overnight, or in a cool basement overnight (depending on house temperature, time of year, amount of starter in the dough, etc.) and then shape and proof them the next morning. Generally I mix, autolyse (30 min), mix / knead a bit, then stretch and fold for 2 to 4 hours (again, depending on the dough, the blend of flours, the hydration, etc) until the dough seems strong and stretchy and stays in a nice ball after the stretch & fold. They sit out at room temperature for 4 to 5 hours usually, then go into the cooler place to bulk ferment. Shaping is done cold (pre-shape, rest, then shape) and the loaves are left to proof at room temperature until they are 'ready' (poke test, but depends on the amount of whole grain flour, what kind of flour, etc.). I get nice holes (not too big; I hate it when the melted cheese drips through the holes).
Hi,
I’ve had success with long cold bulk in the fridge for up to 24 hr. After my stretch and folds, I let the dough rest for another half an hour or so before put it in the fridge covered until I’m ready to shape the next day. Hope this helps!
How long after the cold ferment are you letting the dough sit at room temp before you shape and then how long are you letting final proof before baking?