November 12, 2010 - 4:22pm
Converting 100% starter to 65%?
I've been baking with my 100% starter for about 3 months now, using the same Norwich recipe. I've read that using 65% starter may contribute to a tangier loaf, so I'm wondering how to do this without converting the whole recipe? I'd like to try other types of bread. I measure my starter in gram weights.
Thank you,
Mira
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Are you are using Susan's (from Wild Yeast) Norwich Sour dough recipe? You need to work out the numbers carefully so that ultimately you have the same total amount of water and flour in the recipe. If you don't, you will throw out the total hydration of the dough.
She requires 360g of starter at 100% hydration. That 360g of starter will consist of 180g flour and 180g water. If you want to keep the amount of flour the starter contributes the same but you want to change the hydration of the starter to 65%, you will need to feed as follows:
Feed 180g starter 90g flour and 27g water. You will now have 180g of flour and 117g of water. Your starter will now be at 65% hydration.
However, your total water in the recipe is going to be short by 63g so you are going to have to add it to the final dough. Your adjusted recipe will look like this:
Ingredients:
900 g white flour
120 g whole rye flour
663 g water at about 74F
297 g ripe 65% hydration sour dough starter
23 g salt
Now you can proceed with the recipe, but there are a few things you should know.
Mixing a starter at 100% hydration into a dough is easy. It quickly dissolves into the water and is soon evenly distributed throughout the dough. A 65% hydration starter needs to be broken up into small chunks first. Soften the chunks in the water, then add the flour. Proceed with the recipe. You might want to knead it a little bit more or give it an extra fold to ensure even distribution throughout the dough.
Of course, mixing up a 65% hydration starter isn't going to guarantee you a more tangy loaf. It is commonly accepted that a lower hydration starter at lower temperatures will contribute to a more sour sourdough but in reality it is not as simple as that. In my experience, mixing up the starter two days before and letting it ripen in the fridge produces more of a tang. Another way that works for me is to allow my 100% hydration starter to go past its peak. Allowing it to do this and (I think) coupled with the high temperatures of the climate I live in produces a really sharp tang. I generally try to avoid this because I prefer a milder sourdough and a starter like this breaks down the gluten in the dough quickly. If you don't keep the bulk fermentation time short you end up with a sticky mess.
Finally, you might have to adjust the bulk fermentation and proofing times as firmer starters (lower hydration starters) are not as active as more liquid starters.
I will be interested to hear how it turns out for you.
Syd
Hi Syd,
Thank you so much for your reply. Yes, I am using Susan's recipe from her Wild Yeast blog. Now I understand how to convert to 65%:) So that 297 grams of starter is actually at 65% hydration. Got it. I'm feeling a little slow - or tired - right now so I've cut and paste your answer for future reference:)
I do usually let my starter go just past its peak before incorporating it. I usually proof at room temperature for 1 1/2 hours then retard in the refrigerator for 12 - 14 hours.
I live in Toronto and have admittedly not tasted any sour sourdough made in my city; am wishfully thinking that I can emulate what I ate in San Fran last June!
Thanks again, I sincerely appreciate your taking the time to explain it for me.
Mira
Yes, the starter is at 65% hydration. Sorry, I went and edited my post to correct that mistake.
I usually have a batch of 66.6% hydration starter in my fridge which I either use as starter or just use as old dough for a yeasted recipe. When I make it up I add 2% salt. The salt prevents the gluten from breaking down so quickly and even one week later the dough is still smooth and strong. Salted starter is slower to get into gear so I usually include a sponging step (where I sponge a third of the flour with the starter and two thirds of the water) before I add the remaining flour.
For my basic needs I use:
250g flour
150g water
100g starter
5g salt
I mix up the water, starter and flour into a shaggy mass, let it autolyse for 30, add the salt, give it a 5 minute knead and let it ferment for about 2 and half hours. Then I put it into a glass bowl covered with cling wrap and pop it inot the fridge. The night before I bake, I take out about 240g of it, break it into chunks, mix it with 290g water and 240g flour. I let that sponge overnight and then mix up the final dough the following morning.
Syd
Try this address of an artcle posted on Breadcetera about the double flour addition technique. While the article is oriented towards someone using a stand mixer, some of it can be applied to mixing and kneading by hand. Other than cleaning the whisk attachment of my mixer, I haven't found any downside at all. My breads definitely improved once I adopted the technique.
http://www.breadcetera.com/?p=157
Syd - interesting, I've never added salt to my starter, thanks for sharing your method!
Postal Grunt -I've been afraid to use my KA mixer for mixing dough but this technique looks doable, thanks for the link. My bread crumb has improved over these past few months but I'm not aiming for the huge air pockets I've seen in some photos... I've been using the stretch and fold technique but admittedly miss the actual 11 minute-kneading I used to do in my pre-starter/commerical yeast days...there is something very satisfying to me about hand kneading:)
I have read through this thread and have used Syd's formula for taking a 100% hydration (180g) to turn it into a 65% hydration. I get that part...I think. Did the math and I followed the process :) However, how can I maintain a 65% hydration starter? Just keep doing the same kind of math with my starter? I've always done the 100% and I'm now venturing into keeping starters at different hydrations. I have tried to search here on the site and on the internet...with no success. Any help in pointing me in the right direction or the title of a book that has the info I will need? Thanks!
Total Starter Weight/Hydration Percentage (as a decimal) = weight of flour content
Total Starter Weight minus Flour content weight = weight of water in the starter
Yes? Thanks!
Converting starter hydrations: A Tutorial. Or through thick and thin and vice versa
Happy baking!
David