The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

small commercial bread oven recommendation? doyon, pavailler, bongard, picard?

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koloatree's picture
koloatree

small commercial bread oven recommendation? doyon, pavailler, bongard, picard?

hi,


i was wondering if any freshloaf members have any experience with these ovens. i am looking to purchase one to start a small solo bread business.


 


 

Bread2010's picture
Bread2010

Just wanted to add on to your question -- has anyone used the Unisource Baby Rembrandt Mini Vapor steam tube oven?  or any Unisource equipment?  I've not heard of them...

amandamae422's picture
amandamae422

Hi,


I haven't heard of unisource at all; they appear to primarily be a distributor of other company's equipment though.


You may want to look into the Belshaw family of the companies - Belshaw as a whole owns 6 - 8 bakery equipment manufacturers and their products are high quality. 


Amanda

bakerboy2253's picture
bakerboy2253

Hi, I'm mostly a lurker as you can see from my low # of posts, but I am in the bakery equipment biz so thought I'd offer my 2 cents.


Belshaw is now owned by Ali Spa Italy and has undergone major restructuring. In fact some of their equipment (rack ovens and proofers) is being made by a 3rd party private labeled for Adamatic (Belshaw's sister) and actually are manufactured in China.


Bongard is a highly reputable brand that is a more distant sister of Belshaw under the Ali umbrella, but really has little to do with Belshaw. The biggest source for Bongard products is FBM in NJ but I don't think they offer much in the way of small deck ovens that are in the lower price ranges easy enough for most startups or independants to swallow, at least not in this economy.


The sad truth is that gas powered hearth type artisan deck ovens with steam systems are kind of a go big or go home proposition...easily costing you $30K+ with delivery and install, even for small ones like the Empire mini-tube, unless you're willing to buy used- and even then it's mostly fairly big ones available.


For a smaller oven (say 9 sheet pan size or less) at a reasonable price you would need to go electric. And overall bang for the buck, I would recommend ABS (American Baking Systems).


As for Unisource, I have sold equipment to them, and what I know is that they are not a manufacturer, they are a dealer/agent/broker, and I think they are pretty small in terms of mainstream baking equipment (maybe bigger in restaurant equipment?). Honestly I don't know (yet) who the real manufacturer of their Baby Rembrandt is- this is the first I heard of it. But I will find out.

aetyson's picture
aetyson

Hello.

I am looking to purchase a deck oven, and the Rembrandt looks great.

Have you done any further research?  You seem to be quite thorough, and I would appreciate advice.

Can you recommend this product?  Do you have any further information on the manufacturer?

Thank You!

Ricko's picture
Ricko

I'd love to have a Doyon electric single deck, 2 tray oven,with steam! In fact, I'd give my eye teeth for one!


Although, it would have to go in the basement, which isn't a problem. As it would be next to the electric service box and close to the incoming water.


The only draw backs are things like converting a 100 amp service to 200 amp. The factory up charge to convert from 3 phase to single phase. And then the cost of the unit itself! It's a case of, I don't need one, I just want one! Even the wife is in favor of it, but the guilt of a home baker having a Doyon deck oven for bread baking......seems over the edge!


I do know that there are a few Freshloaf folks that do have these ovens. It would be great if they could tell us all about their experience with their ovens, how nice and to what level their baking skills have advanced to using them!


What's the old saying....a champaign taste on a beer budget!

levinlover's picture
levinlover

Ricko


Please do yourself a favor DO NOT invest your money in any Doyon equipment ! I can go down the list of the issues with this product, however I will just tell you this that I have used one and in plan english it sucks . I am a professional baker with a lot of experience with lots of different ovens and they are at the bottom of the list even my kitchen GE is better.

PicardOvens's picture
PicardOvens

Hello, I just wanted to suggest if possible that you go to the upcoming NRA show in Chicago on May 22nd through 25th.  It may help you make some good decisions.


At the same time please feel free to call and speak to us directly at Picard Ovens.  We are energy efficient and always improving to fit the needs of our customers.


Kristine Marchetti


Picard Ovens, Inc.


800 668-1883


 

bakerboy2253's picture
bakerboy2253

The Doyon artisan deck ovens are very nice but quite pricey for the capacity. ABS (American Baking Systems) are similarly featured but more reasonably priced. And yes some buildings can't supply the amps needed for electric deck ovens with steam. I am now familiar with Unisource and their Baby Rembrandt deck ovens, and I gotta tell you these things are the solution American bakers needed for artisan baking on a smaller scale, with limited electrical supply. They can be natural gas or propane, require only 115V for the controls, they ship assembled and will fit through a 36" door, they have ceramic decks and self-contained steam (they are true vapor tube), made in USA, and most common replacement parts available 3rd party (as in Grainger, etc). Each deck is 4 pan capacity, and you can stack them up to 3 decks high. One of their reps is Bakeryequipment.com

PeterS's picture
PeterS

The oven comes in three versions: 1,2,3 deck. It is a steam heated tube oven, made in the USA (!) and competitive to the better artisan ovens from Europe. You can find specifics here: http://www.unisourcefoodequipment.com/pdf/baby_rembrandt_hearthoven.pdf 

Conveniently, it has many standard parts which are locally available from typical commercial supplies. Maintenance & repair should be less than its imported brethren.

Featurewise, I think I would be happier that a pig in poo with one of these. But, at nearly 800lbs it is probably too heavy to go down my stairs. It's dimensions are nice for getting through doors and it runs on gas, but this is really a full blown commercial oven, especially when price is entered into the equation. The single deck model is about $US15,500+shipping. The cost per square inch of cooking deck decreases greatly with deck count. If you're really up for one of these, give Darren a call (360-876-7250), he is a nice guy, a baker, very well informed and can answer all your questions about this oven.

 

Joe MacBu's picture
Joe MacBu

A bakery equipment rep. once recommended Tayso ovens. They have ones which are gas-powered (through a house gas line or a propane tank) with steam (through a garden hose attachment). There are two models, TG4 and TG8, but they're not cheap. A used TG8 in good condition was quoted to me at $15,000.

PicardOvens's picture
PicardOvens

I just thought it might be interesting for you to know that we welcome clients to visit us and try our ovens before they purchase them if they are unsure of their decision or in some cases we can set up a trial at one of our customers that would be close to your location. Either way it is always a pleasure to help you make sound choices.

 

Kristine Marchetti

Marketing Manager

Picard Ovens, Inc.

1 800 668-1883

www.picardovens.com