Active vrs Instant Yeast
In my search for dabrownman's instructional on making Yeast Water (which I still can't find, but I gotta figure he posted somewhere here), I have bumped into quite a few discussions regarding the differences between the two yeasts.
About 5 years ago I switched from Red Star Active Dry Yeast to Saf-T Instant Yeast (it does take me that long to go thru a 2 pound brick). I am now back using RS Active Dry. I find it has an almost 'cheesy' flavor compared to the Instant, that I prefer.
So many discussions say that Active Dry needs to be hydrated before adding to the recipe.
I have never done that, I just add it dry with the flour, etc. (no sugar). I've never experienced any problems, altho I might be ignorant of what problems I should be looking for.
Any thoughts or advice?
dobie
I was just reading a bit in Peter Reinhart's Whole Grain Breads and came across this point in one of his FAQ:
"Active dry yeast contains a small amount of glutathione, which causes gluten to relax. In side-by-side test bakes, it definitely enhances extensibility; however, I still prefer instant yeast because of the simplicity of adding it directly to the flour. If you use active dry yeast, hydrate it in a small amount of luke-warm water (about 100 degrees F/38 degrees C) for a minute or two to dissolve the grains and activate the yeast."
Proofing would of course determine that the ADY is still viable rather than finding out when your bake fails that the yeast was compromised.
Hi Jane Dough (great handle BTW)
While I'm a big fan of Reinhart's, my personal experience (and apparently that of the folks at King Arthur Flour) shows there is no need to hydrate or activate Active Dry Yeast. You can just add it in as you would Instant.
I remember Alton Brown also once saying that 'the reason the dough didn't rise was because the yeast (he didn't specify which) was just added in and not proofed' and then added.
How do these superstitions get started?
I could be completely wrong (but so could Reinhart and Brown).
If you're baking frequently with yeast of the same source, I wouldn't think there would be a need to proof it. Just my take on it.
dobie
Thank you :)
Peter Reinhart is often "one of the folks at King Arthur".
According to the blog on King Arthur it's only very recently that ADY does not require hydrating as had always been the case. It seems the yeast has been reformulated to a smaller particle size making it unecessary to dissolve It prior to use. This modification would have been well after Reinhart's book was published.
I also don't know if that applies to all yeast or not. Fleishmann's is the common yeast here and still has the direction to dissolve first.
The reason for proofing remains unchanged and is at the choice of the baker of course. Definitely if you bake frequently it is reasonable to expect consistent performance. Yeast is fairly hearty has been my experience.
can vary from country to country and so can the softening directions. That is why I value knowing a country location for discussions, both trouble shooting and answers given. Might be interesting if we could all show blown up pictures (with rule) of our yeast. I bet the variations in sizes and colour would be interesting. Be specific in how the yeast is labeled when posting a picture. :)
(I can visualise a photo taken of some yeast piled up on the original wrapper with a ruler nearby.)
I've experience that the larger the grain or size of the yeast particles, the more care is involved in softening it or preparing it for the dough. The protective coating around the yeast can very in thickness and composition.
Here is a link in the site Yeast FAQ... the package is about 4 inches across (wish I had put in a cm/inch ruler) http://www.thefreshloaf.com/comment/47252#comment-47252
The Allinsons dried active yeast that we get here in the UK is one that ideally has to be dissolved in water. If you put it straight in with the flour, you end up with crunchy bits of yeast in your bake. I tried, just out of curiosity, but I'll go back to doing it the usual way.
Allinsons also do the instant yeast, but I've never tried it. Besides, it almost costs twice as much LOL.
Interesting - will grab a pic of my yeast later and post it.
Reynard,
Just to say I appreciate your input.
I will get back - concerning these issues.
But as for now, I am in the state of flux.
Thank you -
dobie
Thanks Reynard
I'm surprised to hear that.you end up with crunchy bits if just added straight to a dough mix.
I think a pic would be great to see. I will try to post a pic of the Red Star Active Dry and the little bit of left over Saf-T Instant yeast that I have on hand.
dobie
MO, thanks for the link.
That is some amazing yeast, and would clearly require some softening or hydrating (proofing) so to speak.
If Reynard's Allinsons yeast is anything like it, no wonder he would get crunchy bits in the bread if not pre hydrated.
dobie
The plumbing was definitely female ;-)
Anyways, here's a pic of the Allinson's yeast alongside a mm scale.
So I have a few thoughts on the subject. First, I am sure that the commercial active dry yeast is strong enough these days that it is not always necessary to hydrate the yeast first (I'll use the term hydrate rather than proofing since it is more accurate for the discussion). Some of the variables that need to be taken into account are the hydration of the dough and the temperature of the water being added. I would think low hydration doughs might not fare as well as higher hydration doughs as well. SAF states that the ADY can be added to the other dry ingredients if the water added is 110F. I have never added water that warm to my dough as I prefer to have my final dough temperature 76-80F (depending on the bread being made).
My approach to bread dough is to use as little yeast as necessary. By hydrating active dry yeast it makes it more vigorous. So instead of using it straight in the dough, I hydrate active dry but often use less than called for in the formula. Nowadays I use instant yeast anyway.
Manufacturers suggest against using instant yeast for refrigerated doughs. By this they are referring to the no-knead recipes that sit in the refrigerator for more than a day. The instant yeast is said to be too active for this type of dough. This is not the same as retarding a dough overnight. I know plenty of people use instant yeast for these anyway without issue, but they might have to use less yeast.
I can't remember which book, but I remember reading one author that hydrates instant yeast as well to get it moving along. I don't do that, but I guess there are those that do (in rare cases I think).
Maverick,
Good response. I need to digest what you suggest.
I can agree with the term 'hydrate' rather than 'proof' in that the first is required for the later.
Sorry to make my ignorance so apparent, but what is 'SAF'?
dobie
Lesaffre yeast company? corportation? inc? One of those. Not so common in Canada...
Thanks Jane Dough
I know I've heard of SAF before but never knew what it meant. Not so common here in the States either.
Obviously a French company, yes?
dobie
http://www.fermex.com.au/lesaffre/
http://www.lesaffre.com
First, I understand and agree with most of what you say.
I think when it comes to hydrating (or proofing) either yeast, the temperature of the water that is used is most relevant if it gets over 115F (or whatever the actual temperature that yeast dies at is).
You can take flour from the freezer, yeast from the freezer and water from the fridge and while it will make for a mighty cold dough, sooner or later it will come up to room (or proofer) temperature and become just as active as if all the ingredients started out at room temperature, or 115F or whatever. In my experience, it'll find room temperature and act accordingly.
I think it is when you are working on a schedule that temps and times become very important and exacting. But if you can wait it out, it will come out.
I think that is why using less yeast by measurement works well. The beasties grow on their own given the right environment. It just takes a blend of time and temp and of course, the right ingredients.
I don't think whether you use ADYeast or Instant, for refrigerated, or no knead (or mixed in a KitchenAid and baked three hours later) dough, makes much of a difference at all. It's the time and temp, I think.
It seems to me that to hydrate (proof) the yeast or not, makes no difference other than the time/temp quotient.
Of course I've been wrong before, but that's my experience.
dobie
Not sure whether Instant Yeast is the same as Rapid Rise or Fast Acting, but am under the impression that those are designed for recipes where the dough is only allowed to rise once, and might be fairly incapable of providing a second rise. So perhaps not a viable alternative to other forms of yeast in every case?
It would be best practice to rehydrate any dried yeast in warm water. This is especially true for ADY. I too, like Reynard have experienced lumps of undissolved ADY yeast in a dough mix.
Compressed / fresh yeast isn't dried as such and can be added directly to the mix but direct contact with sugar or especially salt should be avoided. I don't think there was ever any doubt about this.
http://sfbi.com/pdfs/NewsF03.pdf
Used to be called dried yeast when it was first introduced in 1850. It was also known as German or compressed yeast. That was to differentiate it from other forms of yeast in use for bread and pastry baking. :-)
It can lead to confusion when using older cookery books - I usually tend to assume that they mean cake yeast and use half the quantity of active dry.
Hey Reynard
How do they make that stuff, anyway? I'm guessing it's not just pure yeast; there must be some vehicle that creates its bulk (perhaps some sort of flour)?
Introduced in 1850, I'm guessing it pre-dates both Instant and Active Dry. If so, I wonder why that was (apparently) the first form of commercial yeast?
Thank you
dobie