Beginner Questions
Hi There,
Sure could use some help. I'm having a hard time forming dough balls. I used a no knead pizza dough recipe which is very wet, tacky and sticky. I have to use quite a bit of flour to even handle it. I then fold 4 times, turn over and do the circular motion with two cupped hands, rotating the ball in a circular motion, like I see on videos. It does form into a ball shape but the bottom doesn't seal shut. Is that the way it's supposed to be? When I try pinching it, it just has a tail. I've been watching videos and they usually do this fast with not much thought, yet I can't get the hang of it. Also the dough become coarse as a result of adding flour. Is that ok since it was a no knead recipe? so many of the videos I've watched the dough is very smooth and shiny.....confusing....any help would be great.
... so others can see your hydration levels, flour, etc.
You still need to work the dough although a bit differently. Watch videos on Slap and Fold and see how after working it that way the dough becomes more manageable. Being a novice myself this wisdom was imparted to me and was quite helpful: The French Slap and Fold: www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvdtUR-XTG0
The slap and fold and/or turn and folds will help the gluten develop.
using a dough scraper (large and with straight edges) works really well.
I tried shaping, including high hydration dough, with my hands but that didn't work for me either.
Now I use a little flour on the bench, drop the dough ball on top, add just a small amount of flour on top of the ball and then start pulling the dough under with the dough scraper, turning the ball at the same time. They are rather quick movements, wich get easier with practice. Cover and rest.
to make up for no gluten development - thus no knead - like a mixer, slap and folds and stretch and folds - usually 78% or so which is very high for a white bread. It isn't shaped into anything after mixing until being in the fridge 24
hours to develop gluten. By that time it should be much less sticky.
If you are developing the gluten with stretch and folds or some other way, it really isn't an no knead and you probably want to get the hydration down a bit say to 72- 75% to help the stickiness issue.
Happy baking
When working with a wet dough or even showing students that have trouble handling dough, try a bit of flour on your hands and with your fingers locked together pull the dough piece toward you then slightly turn it and keep repeating the process the dough skin will tighten as the base has friction of contact with the bench the dough will soon ball up, too much flour should be avoided as the dough does need to have some grip for the tightening effect, a very light dusting is all that is required.
good luck.
regards Derek
Maybe oil the counter down with olive oil. Plop the dough down on the counter. Divide dough. Wet your fingers with water. Do the folds and shape into balls. It's easier to handle wet dough with wet fingers. After the balls of dough have rested enough, use a dusting of flour to flour the dough and peel. Then stretch the dough out with lightly floured hands.
has a lot of tips in it. Pay close attention to the demonstrator and how he keeps track of the "skin" on the dough to make handling easier. Notice how he pinches cut edges together sometimes. You've noticed how adding too much flour will stiffen the dough and this in turn makes the dough hard to handle.
Think of sticky as your friend and embrace it, think about the skin surface of the dough and how to use it, stretch it to your advantage. Also notice how that same top surface seems to be wrapped around the dough and kept track of, to return on top (most of the time) to rest after the dough has been handled.
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/42535/sfbi-video-shaping
My ideas is this: don't do what I did. Instead, learn bread baking from the ground up by hiring an expert to teach you. All right, you can't afford that. Neither could I. But maybe you can afford to buy a text book written by an expert. I don't mean read a cook book. I mean a book written by a professional for a course for a baking school which has students. If you devote a year to reading a working your way through such a text, you'll be so much farther along than I was when I discovered texts. I'd been baking for decades before I happened upon texts. By that time I'd collected lots of bread recipe books most of which had subsections intended to teach this and that. But none of them approached the subject from the ground up. Texts do that.
Look at these: DiMuzio's Bread Baking; Hamelman's Bread; the Handbook linked at the top of this page. These are just a few. The first two are readily available used at such sites as Alibris and Powell's books. You can often find them in public libraries. Also, watch lots of videos. You seem already to do this but I recommend watching as many as you can find just to get a sense of what's out there.
You might also use The Fresh Loaf to find an experienced home baker in your neck of the woods. Working with such a person can give you invaluable hands-on experience with the choreography of what we do. A minute or two of hands-on can teach so much with the right teacher.
Just a thought...
Thanks for the advice here. It's the Jim Lahey Serious Eats no knead. It is very stringy when coming out. Will try some things here. I think I have those books suggested. I've also had problems shaping loaves before. All this talk about baker's percentage etc, but the actual hands on shaping and handling is eluding me so far. Any teachers out there? I'm in St Paul, MN. Thanks
I find that I prefer working with a lower hydration level. I use 15 ounces of flour, 10 ounces of water, 1 1/2 teaspoons of salt and 1/4 cup of sourdough starter (or 1/4 teaspoon of yeast). I feel that the bread rises more up than out and I think I get pretty decent crumb. Here is what a loaf of my almost no-knead sourdough looks like. You do need to knead it a bit before you shape the loaf. Very minimal though, about 10 or 15 kneads should do it.