Vertically Challenged
or how much oven spring should I aspire and how to achieve it.
I've been working with the same recipe (documented in my blog...it is about 20% rye) for at least three bakes and its a fairly wet dough, 65-70% hydration. The flavor is fantastic...no complaints there. I'm getting nice airy crumb but I'm wondering if the loaves should/could be taller. Or, is this type of dough inherently oval domed shape as a rule.
I think I'm following all the rules, minimum 2 hours of every 30 min S&F, bulk fermentation till almost double in bulk, preshape gently, 30 min rest, shape gently and into the proofing basket. I have been doing overnight cold rise....approximately 6-8 hours. Then into the hot DO...I didn't finger poke...possible they need more fridge time...or counter time before bake....so many variables it makes my head spin!
Last night I did a double batch and am long cold proofing half of it till later today....approximately 21 hours just to see how they will come out.
I'm also going to bake a total wheat based loaf and see if I get more spring.
Obligatory picture of this morning's loaf (banneton for size reference)....still hot so no crumb but I expect it to be similar to the last two (I hope). And even though I made both batches equally, the loaf on the left seemed slightly wetter too so maybe that tells me something.
...of the final dough after s&f?
Successful.
Ok. So that's fine. You say you bulk ferment till almost doubled. Almost doubling is sound advice for final proofing. When it comes to bulk fermenting it's normally double - triple. Can you check up on that?
You managed to only retard by 12 hours instead of the 36 you thought you might've had to do. You could have done a full bulk ferment and then just retarded 20min after shaping and putting into the banneton.
You might have to experiment when retarding. Sometimes you might have to finish off at room temperature if it hasn't completed but mostly you can bake straight from the fridge. All depending on how cold your fridge is and when you put it in. I like to give it 20min bench time after shaping and before retarding. I find if I do this it is ready to bake straight from the fridge. But of course everyones situation will be different. 2 people can follow a recipe exactly the same and get different results. Our starters are different, room temperatures are different and our fridge temperatures will differ. A bit of trial and error will no doubt be needed. Perhaps it overproofs slightly in the fridge in which case you'll need to retard straight away. Final proofing is a very difficult to judge exactly.
Hope this makes sense.
to learn in baking bread is to know when the dough is properly proofed and ready for the oven. It just take experience and there are a lot of variables. The more whole grains in the mix the less proof - say 85% - you want when white bread can be proofed to 95% and still get decent spring. The biggest problem new bakers have is that they over proof their dough because they don't know what 90% proof looks like for their basket. For the longest time I was in this camp. I finally posted a picture of the dough when it went into the basket and one where I thought it was properly proofed. Mini Oven took one look at them and immediately said my dough was way, way over proofed Baskets are hard to tell because they taper greatly on the bottom and a small rise of 1" is a double in volume and might be over proofed. Plus the poke test doesn't work for cold retarded dough at all and even on room temp dough by the time it says I'm ready it is already over proofed.
What I tell people is to make 2 loaves and put 1 in the basket and one in a tin so that it exactly fills the tin half way. Once the tin has risen 1'2" above the rim in the middle of the dough (not the sides) look at your basket. How ever it looks at that time it is proper risen and ready for the oven. Now all you have to do is have the oven hot at that time and ready to go too.
Happy Baking .
response...thank you both...I'm going to keep experimenting and see what combination works for me. I like being able to put in the fridge overnight and get a fresh loaf in the a.m. so may need to accept lower loaves....they still look good inside and taste fantastic.
I also still have 2 in the fridge to cook when I get home from work in 4 hours....will be interesting to see how they come out. Report later!
And I'm going to do a full wheat test for comparison.
they will in any way be restricted in oven spring. I retard all of my breads for final proofing and either bake them cold right out of the fridge, if fully proofed, and or let them warm on the counter while the oven heats to get them fully proofed but still baking them while the dough is very cool. it is getting them properly proofed and the oven hot at the same time that is the key to good oven spring.
Happy Baking
both loaves appear to be somewhat over-proofed. They did experience some oven spring, so they weren't totally gone, but the crust coloring speaks to having fermented too long. Notice how some areas of the crust are pale with darker bumps? The paleness is a strong indicator that the yeasts in the dough had consumed close to all of the available sugars in the dough. The bumps are darker because they stand a little further away from the body of the loaf and reach higher temperatures.
If you can remember about how much of the brotform was filled by the dough when you took it out, aim for a bit less inflation with your next batch. One helpful indicator that some folks use is a small glass container as a gauge; a shot glass, for instance. When shaping the loaves, pinch off a small bit of dough. Shape that into a small ball and gently tamp it into the glass container. Mark the height of the dough ball and make another mark twice that high (you can put a piece of tape on the side to mark on, if you want). Cover the container with plastic wrap and place it next to the brotform so that it experiences the same conditions as the loaves. When the top of the dough ball reaches the second mark, it's doubled. And the loaves will be, too. You'll probably be surprised at how small the loaves look, compared to your expectations.
Best of luck.
Paul