How to switch to SD white breads
This is a two part question:
1) I am currently building a rye starter which I will keep going in the fridge with weekly feedings for future rye breads. However, since I am taking the time to build this, I'd like to enjoy the fruits of my labors as much as possible. How do I create a SD starter for white breads? Do I have to start all over or can I use some of my rye starter and start incorporating white flours? If so, how much at a time and how long should I wait before using it in white breads?
2) I have a couple of white bread recipes that I currently use that I really like and that I've gotten a feeling for, but they use instant yeast. Once I have a white bread starter, can I adapt those recipes, or do I just need to find new ones? And if I can adapt them, how should I do it and what should I know about the process?
Hi hanzsobm,
you can easely convert part of your rye starter to a wheat starter.
Take like 10g of rye starter and feed with 5g rye starter and 5g wheat starter and 10 gr water.
Next feeding feed with 3g rye starter 7g wheat starter and 10g water until you feed with only wheat starter, you can also build up to a bigger amount of wheat starter to store in the fridge.
My 50% hydration wheat starter started out as 100% hydration wheat starter , then parts of it was convertet to rye starter, whole wheat starter , 50% hydration wheat starter...
You can always change your starter by taking some and converting it to what you need.
Hi Hanzosbm
I'll address the second part of your question, since it's a subject I've been researching myself for about two weeks now.
I haven't yet converted a yeast-based recipe to a sourdough-only one (at least, not yet), but I've been successfully converting yeast recipes to "hybrid" doughs (using both a sourdough starter and commercial yeast) for the past week or so. Here's how to do it, according to King Arthur Flour: "Your starter is more or less equal parts flour and water, by weight. So try using [your starter] in recipes that include both flour and water (or milk). Start by substituting a small amount of starter, and increase it if you like the results."
In practice, do this: substitute 1 cup of sourdough starter (8.25 oz) for 1 cup of flour (4.25 oz) and 1/2 cup water (4 oz.) in the recipe.
I've followed these instructions and had such excellent results that I posted pictures of the breads on my Instagram account. I was planning to post the pictures on my TFL blog soon.
If you'd like, I can give you the exact recipe I followed (for Scali bread and Italian Supermarket bread on KAF website).
Good luck!
Hanzosbm, I forgot to add this:
If you're using an unfed starter, you don't need to make any changes to the yeast amount in the recipe.
If you're using a fed starter, you decrease the amount of yeast in the recipe by 25% to 50%.
MicheleV
1. No problem at all. Take a little off your rye starter and build a preferment using white bread flour. If only a little starter is needed then you can even stick with rye. If a larger amount of starter is called for then build a white one from a little rye starter.
2. You have plenty of room for self expression when converting. All you need to do is take some of the flour and water called for in the recipe and turn that into the starter you add in. Depending on the % you'll need to change fermentation time. For example...
500g flour
350g water
10g salt
1tsp IDY
simply ignore the IDY and take from the 500g flour and 350g water enough to build a preferment and add it back in. A good range, but by no means the golden rule, is flour+water = 10-30% for a starter.
So you could do...
450g flour
300g water
10g salt
100g starter (50g flour + 50g water added as starter)
....and this will give you a 22% starter.
But a sourdough takes longer. With 22% starter you can easily do a 3-4 hour bulk fermentation incorporating stretch and folds at this stage then shape and final proof till ready. I say "till ready" as you'll have to be the judge at this stage.
Thank you all, this is exactly what I was looking for. That being said, it looks like it'll never be a drop in adjustment to a recipe. By that, I mean I can't say "swap out a teaspoon of instant yeast for a quarter cup of starter". Even getting the measurements right (which you have definitely made clear), the fermentation times are going to be different. Looks like I'll need to do some experimenting.
in a recipe it has no effect on the hydration. You're just adding in the yeast.
Because sourdough starter "is" flour + water then swapping bakers' yeast for sourdough you have to take this into account.
So my example above will produce exactly the same ratio of flour and water as the original except converted to sourdough.
Now depending on how much of the flour + water you have converted as a starter to replace the bakers' yeast you'll need to adjust fermentation time.
To get it down to the minute so that the moment you've put the dough in the oven is the moment the yeast has maximised its potential is a bit difficult to work out. And even if you do work it out then you're treading on a tightrope as you can miss it.
If the starter is around 30% of the flour (flour in the recipe is always 100%) then you can safely bulk ferment for 4-6 hours with enough time to knock back, shape and final proof. Slightly less then you can increase the time a bit. If it's a very hot day then decrease the time a bit. But you're within the ballpark where you're playing it safe.
Of course you could knead till gluten is fully formed and go straight into final proofing but you haven't gained the full potential of a sourdough and you might end up with a poorer quality bread. So you need to work out how much time you have to work within a safe limit. So let's say 9 hours for optimum time. Then form dough, bulk ferment for 4 hours incorporating stretch and folds, knock back, shape and final proof (which could take anything between a time scale but won't take longer than a few hours) then bake when ready. You can manipulate the fermentation time by retarding in the fridge.
I suggest you follow a sourdough recipe before you start experimenting so you can see what's going on.