January 10, 2015 - 10:57am
Cracked sourdough loaf
Hello all,
I made some sourdough bread with my starter today. The result smells great but doesn't look it unfortunately:
The sides are cracked. I did put a small pan of water in the bottom of the oven so there must have been some steam.
Could it be that it was overproofed? Or did I not cut into it deep enough prior to putting it in the oven? I pretty much followed Paul Hollywood's basic sourdough recipe (but doubled the amounts). Bulk fermentation for 5, proofing for ~ 4 hours.
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Would like to see a cross section of the loaf. It does smell good. My imagination can smell it from here. Buttery! :)
Mini
Hello,
thanks for your reply! Here's a crumb shot, taken before freezing half of it:
71pQNMK.jpg
are going on or needed. More power in the yeast (how old is it?) More heat under the loaf > scoot the steam pan to the side or use a darker bread pan or lower the pan toward the heat source. The top might have dried out or baked too soon hardening before the main spring so it sprung along the sides. Might be able to correct with a foil tent the first part of the bake and/or lowering the loaf in the oven.
Can you tell us about the oven settings, rack position and time in the oven/temp. Did the shaped dough fill the pan 1/3, half full, or 2/3 full?
Also, tell us about your starter, age, how did you feed it and how long does it take to peak in activity? Room temp?
I know, 1000 Q's, sorry but the more you tell us the easier it is to help. :)
Is this the recipe?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/classic_sourdough_21029
Hi, thanks for your help. I've tried to summarise the answers to your Q's below. If there's any additional information you need I shall do my best to provide it.
- Shaped dough filled the bread tin 2/3 full.
- Oven settings: 30 min at 220°C, 20 min at 200°C; top and bottom heat. My oven's calibration isn't 100% spot on so I can't guarantee those were the exact temperatures in the oven. I did try my best, however, to compensate for the oven's bias.
- I put some tin foil on top after 25 min or so because the top was getting dark.
- The loaf was in the lower third of the oven.
- Starter Info: about 2 weeks old, doubles reliably between feedings (ca. 12 hours apart). I feed it at a 1:1:1 ratio with water and whole grain flour (wheat). I built it up to the quantity required the day before baking, over two feedings (one in the morning, one in the evening).
- The pan with water was placed on the bottom of the oven for the entire time.
Thanks again!
I tried a slice of the loaf yesterday and it tasted good so at least it's not a complete failure.
1) Check your oven to make sure the lower heat works at the setting you use. If you have hidden coils, place hand on oven floor and turn on oven it should warm up fast.
2) What is the temp of the starter as it is rising after a 1:1:1 feeding? To me this is not enough food unless the room is very cool. (we can quickly resolve this problem)
1) Will check and report back.
2) The room is fairly cold. I'd say room temperature but definitely not warm (It's the kitchen so the heating is off most of the time). Do you think I should increase the ratio to something like 1:2:2?
I needed 500g of starter for the recipe so I took 20g of starter and built it up by adding 120g of water and 120 g of flour (bringing it to 260g) and then another 120g of water and 120 g of flour. Maybe that process can be improved upon as well?
a 20:120:120 feeding is a 1:6:6 ratio feeding and then followed by 1 : 0.46 : 0.46 Now is that while the kitchen is warm during the day and cool at night?
A starter fed 1:6:6 should more than double before being fed. It should be quadrupling in size. How does it react to the food?
Sorry, by 1:1:1 I meant the ratio when I do my regular starter feedings, not the "build up" prior to baking.
The kitchen is relatively cool during the day as well. After the 1:6:6 feed I'd say its volume increases by 2-3x. Difficult to say though.
What do you suggest as far as feeding ratios go when going from say 20g of starter to 500g?
but in your cold kitchen you might want to try 1:2:2 20:40:40 and then 100:200:200 and see how it works out for you.
How long does it take 20:40:40 to peak out? Not just double. That is the question. If it has peaked just before the next build and starting to flatten out or fall, then the 1:2:2 ratio is about right. If the starter peaks sooner, then think about higher food ratios. Simple as that. But I think the 1:6:6 is too high right now.
If you want a more sour tasting bread, the builds can be manipulated with over and underfeeding. So there is plenty of room to play with starter builds. I would just like to see the yeast doing it's job first. How's that oven coil?
Just tested the oven. I have visible coils on the top and the sides. The bottom of the oven gets warm fairly quickly when I turn it on.
As far as the feeding ratios go I'm a bit confused. Are you saying I should experiment with doing it in 3 steps? If so, I'd end up with more than 500g of starter wouldn't I?:
20 + 40 + 40 = 100g. Then 100 + 200 + 200 = 500 g. Then 500 + 1000 + 1000 = 1500g?
Sorry for my stupid questions but I'm relatively new to this :-)
Oh sorry, I think now I understand what you mean. I misinterpreted the space between 1:2:2 and 20:40:40. I'll probably end up doing another bake next weekend and will try the ratios you suggested.
I should have put the 1:2:2 in parentheses (1:2:2) to make it easier to read. Sorry. Oh, and there is no such thing as a stupid question, at least not here.
OK, then hope to hear from you with next weeks bake...
and the oven?
If the lower coil works, try a darker pan, one not so reflective of the heat. Might also want to try one score down the middle or from one corner to the other for a "twisted look." A little tilt to the angle of the knife might elevate one side over the other. Up to you.
The lower coil works (bottom of the oven gets warm). I could also try the 1:2:2 ratio with my 30g of "mother" that I maintain and note the time it takes to peak right?
and don't feed it again until after it peaks. Is it out on the counter top?
How is it the oven has coils on the sides?
The oven looks a bit like this:
$(KGrHqJ,!r!FEzmPkg,EBRcRlNYzzQ~~48_72.JPG
Do you have any tips for recognising when the starter has peaked?
Oh sorry, of course it doesn't have coils on the sides. Silly me! Only on the top and the bottom.
only lighter in colour.
Lets see... recognising when the starter has peaked.... if you put the fed starter in a narrow glass or jar, you can see the rise better with small amounts. The starter will need about 4 to 5 times its volume for head space to expand. I usually mix up in a separate bowl and pour or stuff into the glass taking care not to mess up the sides. OR scrape down the sides with a narrow spatula. Wet a finger and level out the starter. Mark the level. Once the yeast builds in numbers and things get cramped, gas will collect into bubbles and push up the starter and it may appear to have a slight dome as it rises. If the starter is too thin, bubbles will escape and break the surface before it can rise, then you might decide to thicken it up just a little bit so it is more like a soft dough, keep the same flour ratio but use a little less water.
A typical wheat starter will rise, form a dimple in the middle and then flatten out before it starts to fall back down. if left alone, it will rise a second time after enough gas has escaped to collapse or fold the gluten back onto itself. Always fun to watch but I'm talking about the first peak. It may leave marks on the glass as it falls so that is why it's important to have the sides clean. If the starter peaks and falls while you're not looking, then you can tell you missed it.
A rye starter is a little different in that it doesn't like to fall after peaking (stubborn thing) and sometimes needs a poke to see if it will deflate. A bread flour usually rises higher than an AP wheat and that higher than WW and rye will be the low riser. Gluten free starters will not rise but produce gas none the less and it can be trapped in a deflated plastic bag tied over the starter jar. Also works well with very liquid starters. When the bag inflates and starter tastes sour and smells yeasty, the starter has peaked. I hope this isn't too much information too soon.
Here is another thread, a little bit similar. I was looking for some pictures when I ran across it. Will keep looking for pictures.
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/comment/233685#comment-233685
So it seems that my starter "peaks" in less than 12 hours if fed at 1:2:2. What does that imply for baking?
Maybe more flavour. It means, use a high ash flour so the dough survives the long rise. It also means that if you make a recipe where the flour is twice the weight of the starter, it will take approx. 12 hrs to go from mixing the dough to final shaping at whatever temperature you did the test. Gives a rough idea.
It also means you should give dough a longer time to rise or use a proofer.
A 1,2,3 sourdough (s,w,f) would take much longer but you could split the flour in the recipe into builds. Mixing first with 1,2,2 for 12 hrs, then adding the rest of the flour (and salt) after the mixture has peaked for a faster rise and fluffier crumb. Your pre-fermented dough portion is higher and the fresh flour addition will give more fluff to the loaf.