October 17, 2011 - 4:33am
Bulk fermentation needed when using sponge starter?
Hi guys, my question is..... When using a 50% sponge starter, is a bulk ferementaion of the final dough required? I've never used it up until yesterday when i made some crusty rolls, and the result was no where near as good when no bulk ferementation was used. I found that moulding/shaping the dough was difficult, and after the final proof the risen rolls looked as if they had air bubbles, which later resulted in blisters after baking....
Any feedback greatly appreciated :-)
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Sounds like there are multiple factors at work here that could have impeded the success of your rolls.
First off, to address your primary question, yes you still have to have some bulk fermentation, even when using sizeable pre-ferments (50% is a lot of pre-ferment!) What's important is to not have as much time as you normally would because the bread will develop faster, given the kick-start of, in this case, your sponge. If your dough is tough, it means the gluten has had time to significantly develop--perhaps over develop in your case. Those bubbles that went and blistered on you could have had had a couple of origins: irregular shaping, insufficient degassing during folding, odd distribution of sponge in final dough mixture--and to top it all off, did you make any slices on the dough before baking, or poke some holes in the top so that the gas could properly vent?
I've hardly found a time when using pre-fermented dough didn't make the bread taste better in the end. Getting the process to work, though, is about 1/3 trial and error, 1/3 research and advice, and 1/3 bread mind-reading. Good luck, and don't give up on bulk fermentation!
formula, with 50% of the flour pre fermented you may wish to consider that you are beginning to exhaust the food in your flour - this can have an impact on crust color/flavor/etc.
Other bakers who pre ferment a large portion of flour find that the addition of diastatic malt (in small amounts) will "punch up" the amylase action and along with a bulk ferment provide better flavor.
Something to think about.
... or do you mean 50% hydration sponge?
If so what percentage of the total flour was prefermented?
a typical sponge i use for most things is;
50% Flour, 100% Water and 1% Yeast (left to ferment for 3-5 hours)
Never had problems with crust/colour/flavour....
What is the recommended amount of flour in a sponge then?
Cheers
As far as I know, a typical "sponge" is made with half the flour, most or all of the water, and just a smidgen of yeast. So "50% flour" seems right. Depending on your recipe, "all" the water is probably something like 70% of the total weight of all the flour in the recipe (bakers' percentage).
(I don't think there's really any "right answer" though; I suspect there's not really any "standard". I've also heard talk of "quarter sponges". And I've heard the idea that a "sponge" is essentially a "poolish" and should have equal parts by weight of flour and water. In the end, if it makes good bread, it's "right" ...despite what theory may say:-)
To try to respond directly to your original question: Yes, when you use any pre-ferment --including a sponge-- you still need to do the bulk rise step of the final mix. (If your pre-ferment was a very large component of the final mix, the bulk rise might be a bit "shorter", but it should still exist.)
thanks for that peice of advice... a question i still have not had answered is; after a bulk ferementation i find that the dough becomes difficult to mould/shape and then results in air bubbles and blisters after bake, any ways to avoid this?
thanks