Pastry Knife for Kichenaid and Hobart N-50
While I do not have a Kitchenaid or Hobart N-50 Pastry Knife for sale, I do have some information on them. I recently purchased a JP10A Stainless Steel Spiral DoughHook online. I received it today and it looks well made and is made of polished stainless steel. I plan on giving it a workout this weekend. In the box, there was a pamphlet that advertised their products. Among them mentioned was a Pastry Knife. I was so impressed with this attachment, I emailed the seller and asked if they had Pastry Knives available for the Hobart N-50. He replied just now stating, they are going to start with pastry knives for the Kitchenaid Artisan, Classic and Ultra Power mixers. All testing for the pastry knives for these models are complete so they going into production at this moment. So we should be seeing these soon. For the Hobart N-50, there is one that is currently undergoing initial testing and evaluation in the US. In about 6 months, he said they will have the results from those tests and know more about the pastry knife for the Hobart N-50 then.
Could you share a link to the seller you mention?
Sorry for the delay, I had some computer issues. I can supplymore than that. As a matter of fact, I just checked again and the seller has the stainless steel pastry knives available for the N50. I just bought one and can't wait for it to arrive! The link is: https://www.ebay.com/itm/223954109644
I hope it won't be a problem, but here is a picture of what it looks like.
Thanks for sharing, this is a nice realisation.
However one remark : like every knife, a pastry knife must be sharp-edged (not as much as a razor of course, but with some kind of leading edge anyway) ! Here I can see only a very flat and smooth profile, I'm afraid the main thing was forgotten in this design and I'm reserved about the efficiency of this tool which is going to do the same job than the flat beater :-/
Icallled the seller to ask them about the knife edge on the pastry knife. They haven't gotten back to me yet about a knife edge on the attachment. Hopefully that can be added to it.
I never had a pastry knife for a mixer before, so I wouldn't have noticed the blunt edge. It would be great if the company could sharpen the edge, but if they were unwilling to do so, it would be fairly straightforward to sharpen it at home on the grindstone. I guess just grind the leading edge on each side to a wedge. I found a picture that may be helpful:
I've contacted the seller about the blunt edge.I am waiting for a reply back. Blunt edge or not, this is better than what I have. When I get it in, we'll have to give it a test drive. I found some recipes online for GF Ukrainian Easter Babka Bread I am dying to make and try.
Sharp edge is mandatory on this attachment : this is the only feature which allows the mass to be divided up into a fine crumbly texture instead of being aggregated (or remain coarse). One minor detail for a significant result !
Concerning the sharpening, I'm affraid it will be difficult to perfectly do it on the final attachment. If you look at a genuine pastry knife, then you will be able to make out the shaft from the blade : my guess is that the blade was made from plain iron bar, then sharpened in its straight form, then bent to the required profile and finally fastened to the shaft (bolting or welding).
Now we are waiting for the sweet dough arm and all the attachment's collection will be almost complete :)
It may not be all that difficult to put an accurate sharp edge on the pastry knife. I've seen some CNC machining equipment do some amazing precision things.
Thanks for sharing. Please post a review when you get it in!
I wish that one was made for the Globe mixers!!
Camarie, maybe if you email them, they can do something or look into making a pastry knife for your Globe mixer. I do know they are very consistent in answering and replying to emails.
OK guys, one more question about pastry knives. I have both a Hobart N50 and a 4.5 quart tilt-head Kitchen Aid, both of which this company sells a pastry knife for. Seems like the task of cutting butter into flour wouldn't really require the power of the N50, and the KA has more and easier speed adjustment. However, the bowl-lift action on the Hobart would allow me to start the motor first, then raise the ingredients slowly into the blade. Which do you think I should buy?
I agree about not requiring the power of the N-50 of cutting the butter into the flour, but I am really concerned about having the exposed pastry knife turning while raising the bowl. I would not want to get entangled into it. In my manual, it is recommended not to go over speed #2 with the pastry knife. So on the N-50, speed #1 has an agitator speed of 139 RPM and an attachment speed of 61 RPM. For speed selection #2 the speeds are 285 RPM and 125 RPM respectively. These speeds more than meet my needs and I'm partial to the N-50. What speed selections are avail for the KA?
I was unable to find any speed specs for the KA, so I ran a side-by-side test next to the N50. Believe it or not, the lowest speed setting, "stir" on the KA, is faster than first gear on the Hobart. The kitchenaid theoretically has infinite speeds, with 6 detents, labeled, confusingly, "stir-2-4-6-8-10". But it starts pretty abruptly in the "stir" speed, and won't go any slower. (Second gear on the Hobart seems to correspond with about speed 3 on the KA) Without the ability to raise the bowl into the knife, I have a feeling that the KA would throw flour everywhere. I'm not worried about safety with the Hobart; just keep one hand on the bowl lift lever and the other in your pocket! As for sharpening the edge, I feel pretty confident in my ability to do it by hand if I have to (in my day job, I cut rather precise bevels on optical lenses with a diamond wheel), but it would certainly be easier if it came from the factory, already sharpened.
jrizzo, thank you for the info, that is good to know. As for the detents on the KA speed, I once had to work on my mother's KA, where some of the detents on the speed control were not working and would stop. I was surprised when I took it apart to find (in this case) the speed control went to a plastic mechanism that had plastic notches for the detents, which in turn connected to a linear potentiometer (volume control). Just like an old stereo with a scratchy volume control, I sprayed it with volume control cleaner and the unit ran fine.
I asked the seller through E-bay about sharpening the blade, and this was the reply:
Hello Joe,You don t have to sharpen it. It works very well like it is. Look at the movie that is in the advert on eBay. It don t work better if it was sharpened. This Pastry knife can be sharpened but then it becomes weaker and will break. We have made it as thin as possible. It is made from Stainless Steel and not normal or hardened Steel. I should not sharpen this Pastry KInife because it works. So? When you have more questions don t hesitate to ask me.
best regards, Jan
Hi guys. I found a link to a video on Youtube by the supplier. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JxE9ugi4-A
Interestingly, it shows the pastry knife being used to make pasta dough. I imagined using it to make say, pie crust, which is not difficult to do by hand for small batches. So I ordered one, and will give it a try on pie crust and for some pasta dough. So now the $70+ price tag is easier to justify because it may be more versatile than just a pastry cutter. I've made small batches of pasta much better in the Cuisinart food processor with a cutting blade, than in any stand mixer. It seems like the knife blade would allows the machine to mix a pasta dough much heavier than any bread dough by cutting the mixture together, rather than beating it into submission with a blunt instrument, like the flat paddle or dough hook. The seller's website, superdoughhook.com, shows videos of a lot of the company's products in action.
Yes, I can confirm this is amazing for pasta. I make a dryer mix that in the video so mine looks much more like the dough mixed in semi-commercial extruders. This allows you to dial in the moisture content perfectly every time.
Let it mix for about 15min (or longer if you want), then just bring it together by hand. When rolling out, just forms suuuuper velvety with almost no effort as you move down through the thicknesses. Cooked it has some of the best body/bite.
I have the KA Model G, which is pretty much the same as the n-50. Shouldn't the pastry knife be used with that machine as well? I think so.
Yes you can use the pastry knife that was made for the Hobart N50 on your very nice old KA Model G.
I saw one on Ebay.
You can also get if from superdoughhook.com
Don't know the difference in price though.
The PK has arrived in this morning's mail. It is just as pictured with sort of a blunt leading edge. I don't know whether to try it as it, or to put an edge on it. I don't necessarily agree with the response that jrizzo got from Jan the seller on making the blade weaker. He may have thought to sharpen the entire blade in one taper from leading edge to trailing edge which would thin the blade out. If you just put an edge on the leading edge without touching the remainder, then you would actually reduce the stress on the blade as it would cut easier though the dough you are mixing rather than pushing through it.
That was my thought as well- that a sharp knife cuts easier than a dull one. The seller seemed to imply that the stainless material wouldn't take a sharp edge and maintain its strength as well as the old tinned steel pastry knives. But I think there's a lot of difference between the sharpness you'd want on, say a chef's knife, and a pastry cutter. And while the unsharpened knife will "work," my question is whether it will function as a pastry blender or, as member flormont suggested, just a thinner version of a flat beater.
Perhaps the open middle is a more crucial difference between the flat beater and the pastry knife than how sharp the edges are. It seems the open middle would allow more of the motor's power to go cutting/pressing the ingredients against the bowl, rather than unhelpfully stirring them around the bowl as does the flat paddle. Maybe it doesn't really matter whether the action is cutting or pressing, just that it happens quickly before the butter melts. After all, my fingers are a lot duller than even an unsharpened pastry knife, and yet they make a pretty good pie crust when pressed into service. I guess I'm just philosophizing here; I am not really a pastry expert. Maybe flormont could comment, if still following this thread.
I sincerely respect all the work made by the couple who are behind Superdoughhook : it's a real chance to have such an actor on the market for high-quality retrofittings capabilities.
However my only tought remains simple : if a pastry hook is supposed to perfectly work with smouth edges, then why Hobart spent time, money and a more complex process to make their ones with sharpness ?
I tested it yesterday after receiving my Model G / N50 pastry knife yesterday. It doesn't beat, it actually cuts. There's no way to get the same result from a 3mm piece of steel. The Hobart is sharper than a butter knife. It's basically like a dull kitchen knife, but as I said in the other thread it required careful handling so as to not slice my hand while removing the "vintage" from it with a scotch brite.
The edge on the bottom, and the two rotating sides are both reasonably sharp.
If anyone wants dimensions let me know.
These are all good points. I am going to try this out as is without making any modifications to it. I will probably get to use it sometime this coming week as this weekend is just too busy. (Even when working from home, upgrades at work need to be completed in unison with the rest of the other teams) I also need to say, just like flormont eluded to, that without this vendor making this pastry knife for the N-50, there would be none available, except for the occasional one that may show up on eBay, since Hobart stopped manufacturing them. I DO like the design by this vendor making it in stainless steel, so if the design is as sturdy as they say it is, you shouldn't have to do anything with it. For the Hobart Pastry Knife, while it is steel, it is tinned and that has to be re-tinned from time to time. Does tinning an item like this have to be done with molten tin or can it be done with an electro-plating process of some type that is food-safe?
I ordered one from these guys, too. I will wait for your review before I attempt to sharpen it. As far as tinning goes, I have used this company http://metalcoatingcompany.com/retinning.html to re-tin the steel bowl on my old Hobart C-100 (the "Breadnought"). They also re-strung the rusty whip with new stainless steel wires. A good company to deal with.
"For the Hobart Pastry Knife, while it is steel, it is tinned and that has to be re-tinned from time to time"
Just for your knowledge : Hobart also made stainless-steel pastry knifes for the european market (at least in the English and French subsidiaries) ... of course they were unaffordable to buy as new item, and now are rare to find out.
As per the appearance of the Superdoughhook attachments, I guess that their flat beater and pastry knives bodies are made by waterjet cutting ... one you have the correct digitalized shape and a good access to this technology, you're able to produce large quantities quite easily and quickly.
This also should explain why the edge are kept strait in the raw matter : not sharpened nor rounded (in the case of the flat beater).
Thanks for the info jrizzo, I will look them up. BTW - It may be closer to next weekend on the trial runs of the new pastry knife.
My wife and I ran several batches of pie dough through the N-50 with the new stainless steel pastry knife. Initially I thought I would need to put a sharp leading edge on it, but I must say, it did a fine job as is. We started off on speed 1, cutting in the butter, then once the butter/flour was pea sized, we bumped it to speed 2. The new PK has a little different shape or profile that the old PK we had. this PK seems to "hug" the side of the bowl a little better that our old one. The old PK tended to push what we were mixing up the side of the bowl and it would force us to stop, and scrape it down back in the bowl. This PK, did not behave that way and there was no need to stop the mixer to bring the dough back off the sides. The consistency of the end product, as my wife put it, "was the best she has seen using a PK". While there were other variables that could have contributed to this, such as using jumbo eggs, since we could not get hold of large or extra large or that a different flour was used because the market had empty shelves where we used to get it, we are very happy with this new attachment. It is also easier to connect this PK to the mixer shaft and it seems more robust at the attaching point. We will continue using and testing this out and report our findings here.
Thanks for the report. I got mine, but haven't had a chance to try it yet. I'm curious how it will do with pasta dough, but that experiment's going to have to wait, because I have homemade pasta in the freezer to use first.
let me know how it works with the pasta dough. We made some more pie dough with it. This was the lightest and best yet.
We actually ran a test between the old Hobart Party Knife and this new one we just got. I was skeptical as I did not think it would perform as well as the old one did. My wife and I first fist some pie dough with the old knife. It came out as it always did. We then ran another batch using the new Stainless Steel. We both agree it did a much better job hands down. We found we had to REDUCE the amount of added water with the new one. After baking, the pie done with the new knife had a lighter flakier crust. When done with the old knife, the baked pie dough tended to be less flaky and more solid in nature. My wife said she is only going to use the new Pastry Knife from now on. So while the old knife is away from duty for now, I am going to send it out to be re-tinned.
How much dough for pate brisee can this paddle/hook be used for in my N5 Hobart Mixer???????
I just want to say that after acquiring a Hobart Pastry Knife for my N50, there is no way possible this one from DoughHook Online could be an improvement. This Hobart version isn't just a leading edge, it's actually reasonably sharp... enough so that when cleaning mine up, I had to be careful not to actually slice my hand.
I was using this thread to seriously consider buying one from this Netherlands company, but ran into a vintage one at a great price. I'm seriously glad I did, and I'm putting this message here for anyone else in the same situation as I was.
A blunt 3/16" edge cannot possible cut the same way a razors edge will.
I think those two terms get used interchangeably. I have a pastry "blender" that is blunt. I had never seen a sharp one until I saw a pastry "knife" at the store.
Hobart calls their agitator a pastry knife. In effect it is the same thing as a handheld pastry blender. But it's not blunt like a pastry blender, and shouldn't be.