The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Whole Wheat Bread from (BREAD)

Mebake's picture

Whole Wheat Bread from (BREAD)

This is from Hamelman's Bread, under (Yested Preferments). I used a Pate fermentee of my baguette dough. I also added no yeast to the final dough. Mixing was very brief with turning the dough in a bowl every 30 minutes for 3 hours, developed the dough well. This is my first time to underdevelop my dough, and using my hand to fold the dough intermittently.

What i ended up with is developed yet soft feeble dough that jumped to life in the oven. The loaves were quite lighter in mass, and the crumb was soft and holey.

I, however, forgot to add the salt to the final dough, so the flavor was quite lacking.


Floydm's picture

Beautiful, beautiful loaves.

Mebake's picture

Thank you Floyd!

SylviaH's picture

Forgot the salt...I've done that my salt has it's own little tiny bowl where it's pre-measured put where it is easy to see so I don't forget it.  I don't buy salted butter, but if you have some it might help the toasted flavor.



saumhain's picture

These loaves look tasty, it's a shame you forgot to add salt... done the same mistake numerous times though(

Mebake's picture

Thanks, Sylvia. I had my head wrapped around the pate fermentee's fermentation time, that i forgot the salt.

Thanks, Saumhain. The pate fermentee was salted, but the dough needs 2 tsp of salt in the final dough.


teketeke's picture

Beautiful looking bread, Khalid!

I have forgot to put salt 2 times so far :O   

I usually prepare the salt while the dough is autolized ( this step is when I feel that I may forget to add salt ). And now I also keep the baking schedule on my bread baking diary so that I don't miss the stage of adding the salt anymore.( After I add the salt, I wrote " v" mark on the schedule) Although I haven't forgot to add salt in the soaker yet .. May be.. I do the mistake in the future... 

Thank you for posting this, Khalid. That keeps reminding me about THE SALT!!

My bread without salt were extremely light and lacking flavor like you described.

Happy baknig,


LindyD's picture

About the salt.  I learned the hard way that the only foolproof method is following JH's advice to always taste the dough.

Wonderful crumb!  How did you keep the breads from baking into each other ?

nicodvb's picture

Khalid, I'm sorry I have to repect myself, but I can't avoid to say that this seems to be your best loaf ever.

As for salt I always dissolve it in the water of the final dough (unless it's in the soaker) because adding it separately gives me the sensation that it's never well distributed. It doesn't really do that much evil to yeasts, so why bother?

breadsong's picture

Hello Khalid, So nice to see more of your pretty whole-wheat bread.
I love the oven spring photos too!  :^)  from breadsong

Mebake's picture

Thank you Akiko! Haven't seen you around lately.

Thanks, lindy! I didn't, they never stuck to one another!

Thank you, Nico! Iam glad you liked it, this indeed is my best whole wheat crumb yet.  As to the salt, i believe that either way, it should work.

Thank you Breasong! I always tend to underproof my doughs. i learned that i need to be bolder with proofing.

Mebake's picture

Thank you daisy!

kim's picture

I really like your ww breads, for the salt issue, I sprinkle my salt on top of my dough during autolyse to prevent my common mistake of not adding them.


raidar's picture

Nice work. They look delish.

dmsnyder's picture

My practice is to weigh the salt into a small bowl and place it on top of the bowl cover for the autolyse. Choose a method and stick to it, but having some systematic reminder will help.


Mebake's picture

Thank You Kimmy! Good advice.

Thank you Raidar!

Thanks David. Actually I did not autolyse. The salt should have gone in with the flour. But nice advice, thanks.

pmccool's picture

before and after the ovenspring occurs are great, Khalid!  I love seeing that happen with my breads, too.

Beautiful work!  Sorry about the salt omission.


wally's picture

From time to time I still forget to add the salt!  Hamelman's injunction is helpful: always taste after mixing.

Maybe spread with salted butter it would be more palatable.


rayel's picture

Hi Khalid, nice bread. I had thought that no salt (1/8 tsp not withstanding) made it harder for the dough's development and structure. It didn't seem to impair the oven spring you achieved however, any thoughts? Did the steamy oven help to pull it off? Your whole wheat breads look terrific as always.  Ray

rayel's picture

Khalid, I missed that the preferment came from your baguette dough. The bread had quite a bit more salt than the pre ferment for the whole wheat. All the turns had to help a great deal. Sorry for the mis-stated first post. Ray

breadmantalking's picture

Truly these are very beautiful loaves. It is clear you put a lot of care and love into those breads. Too bad about the salt. i have done the same :(

All the best

David at

rossnroller's picture

I had read comments to the effect that "everyone" who bakes bread forgets to add salt sooner or later, and smugly determined that that was never going to happen to me. Well, it took 2.5 years, but yep - I finally did it. Not only the flavour but also the crumb texture are affected, I found. Oh well, a lesson learnt! Not a mistake you'd want to repeat. And think of it this way - you've had your turn and now it's outta the way!


subfuscpersona's picture

exactly how does forgetting to include salt affect crumb texture? Can you please elaborate? Thanks - SF

rossnroller's picture

Sorry subfuscpersona, missed your question until now.

It's been a while since my saltless bread mishap, but I recall that as well as the flavour being bland the crumb was a bit saggy and lifeless compared with how it usually is on that bread (forget which formula it was). Not sure about this, but I think the rise was impaired a little, also.

I have no idea whether this finding equates with the theory/chemistry re salt's role in dough development, and of course other factors may have been involved...although this was one of my regular breads that usually turn out well, so I pinpointed the absence of salt as the main issue. And that's about as thoroughly as my jaded memory will permit me to respond, I'm afraid!


Mebake's picture

Thanks Paul! I Love it too!

Thanks Larry! Yep, i believe tasting the dough after mixing will prevent future mishaps.

Thank you Ray! The toasted slices helped balance the somewhat insipid flavor.

Thank you breadmantalking! Iam only learning.

Thank you Ross! In my case, the presence of a stiff biga saved my dough from loosness caused by lack of salt. Fermentation, however, was faster.


teketeke's picture

My!!  I did it again!!! I forgot to add the salt in the french bread T-T

A baguette with NO SALT! T-T  It took 2 days to make..  I never learn it.. T-T I didn't write "SALT" in the baking schedule note book..

Now, I really feel how you felt at this time...




Mebake's picture

Dear Akiko, The solution to saltless bread is to eat it with salty Foods!

teketeke's picture

Thank you, Khalid! LOL  You solved the problem!! Good idea!!

Akiko :)