The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts


Gawker's picture


After my first attempt in artisan baking my family promptly volunteered me for garlic bread duty for the family spaghetti lunch Xmas eve...I figured I'd just do another batch like I did for my introduction and then garlic it but then I decided I wanted to make rolls for dinner at my father-in-law's Xmas eve and lunch at my mother-in-law's Xmas day as well. Well since the rolls are new I'm making a trial run of it today and figured since I already have the oven going I'd try a sandwich loaf as well...I'm now in gym shorts and the lightest shirt I own and dying from the heat. BTW if anyone is wondering why this halfway reads like realtime and halfway reads like I'm writing after the fact it's because I'm a spaz and I'm "blogging" to distract me while the bread does what it does without me getting in the way...oh yeah all recipe's and rights belong their respective owners blah blah blah I take credit for absolutely nothing here except what actually came out of my oven.

So anyways here we go...on the left is my bowl of rolls heading neatly into their 90 minute rise; and on the right a bowl of "Wonder-if-this-is-going-work Bread" dough going through the first 25 minute prior to processing into loaves. At this point all I can think of is how badly I now want a stand mixer so I don't have to do this stuff by hand anymore...maybe for my birthday.

The rolls are almost finished with their first rise but the sammich bread dough yielded two 665 gram loaves that are now panned for their final rise. Here's hoping there's some oven spring in the stars for me today.

Meanwhile back at the ranch, I started working on the rolls but sadly I forgot to take any pictures while I was working...whoops. Anyhow I scaled 36 dough balls at 36 ±2 grams (sorry draftsman and machinist) and reformed them so the insides rolled outside to let them stick together instead of hoping the drier skin on the original rise would allow it to happen. I REALLY hoped they'd go ahead and still rise after that but they did no sweat!

The rolls yielded a dozen clovers roughly 108 grams each and they're now entering their final rise as I'm about to slash and lod the loaves. It's still hot in here and I kinda feel like the proverbial one legged man right about now but I have to admit my timing is working out well because a couple minutes after I finished putting the rolls together it was time to slash and load the loaves. Egg washed for color and into the oven they go...I'm REALLY hoping to get some spring because otherwise these are going to look a little silly... wish was granted somewhat! Ok so my slashes look a little funny but hey I'll get better I promise. Also if the shot looks a little funny it's because this was the only way I could get rid of the glare of the oven light...sorry. SIDE NOTE: Has anyone seen my wife? She was in here when I started this fiasco...but now she's gone...hrmmm..........

Never mind I found her. This pregnancy has been really different than our daughter and seems to be taking a lot out of her. She's asleep with my cat. Oh well onward and upward! (Get it? Upward? Yeast humor!!)

Quickly followed by the clovers slashed, egg washed, and sprinkled with some French Grey sea salt (I was thinking pretzel) and into the oven. Whew anybody getting tired or is it just me?

And thankfully I got some spring again...though now that I think about it they're starting to crowd each other a touch...crap...oh well they're still purdy

So since this recipe says 30 minutes and the cook in me says "Yeah but look at the size of that thing!" I'm guessing being split into muffin cups they'll cook faster so I'm going to pull one when I see them the color I like and check it...

Ok am I supposed to get the loaves out of the pan immediately? cause the bottoms feel a little soggy after cooling a while in the and learn.

And here's the shot of the final clover rolls. Thanks for playing along for those of you who didn't get bored before this point!!!


Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

Brings back lots of memories.  One of my earliest memories was helping my mom make clover rolls.  Looks like they brought you lots of luck too!  :)   Pleasent dreams...

flournwater's picture

Your results belie your words my friend.  If I had enjoyed this kind of success when I started I'd be teaching this stuff.  Well, I do teach it; now.  But it's taken several years to develop any level of proficiency upon which I could ride above embarrassment.

Nice job ....

Gawker's picture

We ALL have something to teach those who desire to learn that which we comprehend. I got called a natural my first time out here and could hardly believe when I read it. I am thankful you took an interest in my baking and I sincerely hope that you will continue to follow along and promise to go "NEENER NEENER YOU SCREWED UP!!!" when I inevitably bake a brick in an attempt at something truly magnificent ;)

EdTheEngineer's picture

They look lovely!

But go easy on the "Yeast Humour" - people will wonder what you're trying to prove.

Gawker's picture

I could hardly breathe when I got this response in my wife thought my brain had shorted laugh I've had all week!

Gawker's picture

Is not...see it? It's right there! No no no not over there...over THERE!!!

Ok to hell with it I ain't foolin' nobody. How about this one then eh? My pregnant wife who hadn't eaten in maybe an hour assisted me in devouring that poor little martyr a good 8 minutes before we pulled the batch. She deemed it "a bit doughy in the middle" and I wasn't satisfied with the color yet, but honestly that bastard lasted maybe a good 60 seconds after it was snatched out of the oven by an unfeeling pair of tongs...noms in spades man!

On a side note here I REALLY (like as in more than you guys could ever imagine) appreciate the support I've gotten with a measly single thread and blog post from everyone here. I have many other hobbies, most of which have dedicated forums, where it literally took months to achieve a feeling of belonging that I felt almost instantaneously here. To those who bothered to read my first thread; to those who have read this first blog entry; to those who will have to put up with me in the future...thank you ever so very much for everything you have, will, or merely might teach me about this magic that we call bread.

Ok enough mushy shit...somebody pass me the butter this stuff ain't gonna friggin eat itself ok?

gary.turner's picture

Loaf pans in the US come in three basic sizes; 8×4, 8½×4½, and 9×5 inches. These are nominal 1, 1½, and 2 lb bread loaf sizes. Your 665g loaves are a little too large for a 1lb pan, and a bit shy for a 1½lb pan. A good place to start for each size pan is 500g, 750g, or 1000g of dough. Adjust on experience with your particulars.

Dinner rolls are commonly about 2oz, or 56g each.  Yours are about double; more suitable for sandwich rolls*, unless you meant to pull apart each clover leaf for the table.

I hope that's helpful.


* 12" rolls at Subway sandwich shops are 6oz.

Gawker's picture

See now I THOUGHT the pans felt a bit too big for my loaves...very good information thank you! Now I'll just have to recalculate my weights backwards to fit the pans instead of assuming the recipe would be right. As for the rolls...the recipe said it made about 18 but I only had a single muffin pan so I just split the dough into a dozen rolls. They're huge but I'm just going to chalk it up to a learning experience and adjust next time ahahahaha!

Janknitz's picture

Try a loaf of the same bread without slashing, just to see what happens. 

HINT:  You may learn what the word "blowout" means.  ;o)

For a beginner, you are zooming across that learning curve pretty darn fast.  Those bakes look gorgeous!

Gawker's picture

As suggested by flournwater, and also because I didn't have enough time to deal with clovers again (those things take FOREVER!) I went with Epi for lunch today. Now having seen what these SHOULD look like in photos around here I know mine are crap but everyone just went on and on over them so without further hot air...

And as far as a "learning curve" goes I don't see myself as particularly experienced by a long shot, though I relish the praise! I'm just trying to understand every little thing that's going on and much of my success is a direct result of simply reading this website and nothing else. Having someone explain this stuff to me, even in a written format, means worlds of difference from reading a recipe and crossing your fingers...and trying to butter a brick when you're through ;)

PS: This fat boy has eaten entirely too much homework this past week...think it's time to take a few days off from the oven ahahahahahahaha

Hope everyone is having a fantastic Holiday!

flournwater's picture


Remember what Mom said?   "Looks aren't everything".  That was her advice when I was deciding which girl to date when I was searching for a good wife.  Mom was right, and the old adage is just as appropriate to the finished bread loaf.  Another popular phrase, "the proof is in the pudding" is the golden rule in judging your bread making.  When you tear off a piece of that Epi loaf and bite into it to experience a warm feeling from its taste and texture, the appearance of the loaf is no longer important.

Compare and contrast:

IMO, you're competitive.

Looks to me like it's time to close this thread and move on to greater things.  I think  you may be ready to teach some of this stuff.

Gawker's picture

Wait a're supposed to use SCISSORS?! No wonder mine didn't look quite right!!! A knife doesn't pinch the end properly like scissors would...and yes I'm competitive. On the other hand I firmly believe that "perfect" is a myth...something literally unobtainable. Even if THIS loaf (hypothetically) is perfect the next one is as likely to end up exploding, or slipping off the peel onto the rack instead of the baking stone, or any of a million other possible outcomes. I think I'm going to start with a few other directions and see where we end up...who's along for the ride? ahahahaha