ryes on the prize?

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squattercity on 26 May 2025 at 08:57

So, as some here may remember, I have had a variety of inconsistencies with my rye starter and my rye breads over the past year or so ... and, among the thoughts that the kind people on this site suggested was that I change up my routine and try some different rye flours. Though I'm not generally good at taking advice, I decided to have some fun with this. So I lined up 3 ryes:

  • Janie's Mill dark rye flour, aka organic whole grain rye (thx, alcophile, for the heads up about their sale)
  • Młynomag Maka Razowa żytnia T-2000 -- from Poland
  • Farmer Ground Flour's organic whole grain rye (my old standby)

Over the past 3 days, I used each to bake a deli rye: 45% rye (all prefermented)/55% King Arthur Organic bread flour, 1% caraway, 1% salt. Here are the results:

Janie's: 

Młynomag Maka Razowa żytnia:

Farmer Ground Flour:

Details:

Janie's is more finely ground than the others and proved to be a very thirsty flour. For making the preferment, I had to raise the hydration to 86% to get all the flour fully moistened.

To my eye, the Młynomag Maka Razowa żytnia and the Farmer Ground Flour were quite similar grinds. Both contain lots of large tan particles and both flours got fully moistened at somewhere around 75% hydration.

Due to scheduling quirks, I let the Janie's levain ferment for 8 hours. Both the Polish and the Farmer Ground levains fermented for about 6 hours. All three of them were inoculated at about 10%.

I baked the Janie's bread full-sized -- about 900 g -- on its own in a large dutch oven.

With the Polish and Farmer Ground flours, I baked 2 mini-batards of perhaps 600 g each, which I baked side-by-side in the same large dutch oven.

Appearance:

Janie's produced a beautiful-looking bread, with great oven spring, a brown and toasty crust, and a nicely open crumb for a deli rye.

For some reason (maybe because I didn't ferment the levain as long), the crusts didn't fully caramelize on the Polish and Farmer Ground loaves. The breads also didn't rise as much in the oven (perhaps because they had less water in the mix) and the crumb in both loaves was uneven -- big holes next to little holes. 

Taste:

The Janie's bread looks fantastic but, oddly, is kind of dull to eat.

Both the Młynomag brand and the Farmer Ground offer more assertive sweetness from the crust (farmer ground even smells sweet when you first add water before fermenting it.) They produced very similar breads, but -- to me -- the Farmer Ground Flour mini batard edged the prize as it more fully showcased the appealing combo of crispy, toasty, slightly sweet crust with a light and lightly sour crumb.

Unfortunately, my "independent rye tasters™" aren't available this week. So, for now, you'll just have to take my word for it. 

Rob

thanks, Tom. I was dumbfounded that Janie's Mill rye didn't have more character in this bread, particularly because it looked so great when I pulled it from the oven. I guess I gotta start saving my pennies for the Abruzzi stuff🤣, though I have to say Młynomag Maka Razowa żytnia is pretty darn good, and reasonable at $2.89/kilo (pre-tariffs) in my local Polish grocery. -- Rob

They look all delicious, Rob

And I'm intrigued by the possible existence of "dependent taster" 😆

Jay

just made me LOL on a very dreary train ride home. Very funny, Jay

The first loaf does look better, Rob, especially the colour of the crust. Did the crust taste better than the rest, or was that flat, too?

What would also be interesting to find out is if they work well to keep your starter happy, without the need for much refreshing before baking (I remember you wrote that you could use your starter directly for baking without refreshing before the problems began).

Thanks, Lin. Yeah, the crust was rather dreary, too -- crisp but not flavorful. 

As for the starter problems, I discovered that, though the grind of the flour had definitely changed, which did force me to change my timings and my inoculation rate, that wasn't the real problem at all. It was this: my partner, who is super noise-sensitive, kept unplugging the refrigerator for long periods of time because the sound of the compressor drove her bonkers.🤣🤣 She's been out of town for a bit and, lo!, the starter now works fine. Love, ya know! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣-- Rob

 

So, to quote the song, you still haven't found what you're looking for? 

Apologies to Bono and Rob 

Although these breads are mighty fine already! And let's face it, doing the same test tomorrow with the same flours could still give you different outcomes, I've learnt not to make assumptions based on a single loaf.

-Jon

agree with Jon. Maybe the increased hydration lead to diluted flavor? Is there anything you could do to prolong fermentation of loaf A without decreasing pH too much?

And I like the name of flour B, Rob

"Hi, my name is Młynomag Maka Razowa żytnia. You killed my father. Prepare to die." 😆