The Fresh Loaf

A Community of Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts.

Fourneau Bread Oven Grande

WAbarb's picture
WAbarb

Fourneau Bread Oven Grande

I am a newbie baker (started 2021)  So my baking failures are definitely due to me and not my equipment (similar to golfers - that doesn't stop me from buying new equipment). I love the Fresh Loaf and have found all of the info posted to be so helpful (thank you all for sharing).  I am posting this only because of the lack of info here on the Fourneau and not because I actually know what I'm doing (but I'm having fun).

Why Fourneau?

After using Dutch ovens I was looking at what else existed for the home baker that did a good job retaining moisture and heat. After sliding down the internet bread rabbit hole I found the Challenger and the Fourneau.  The Challenger really intrigued me because of the larger enclosed space and heat retention. The Fourneau is a slightly different functional concept - more like an front loading oven. I eventually decided to get the Fourneau instead of the Challenger.  This is because the Challenger has a very large & heavy top which could prove unwieldy for me, particularly when its super hot.

What is the Fourneau like? 

It does fit in my oven front to back with hatch facing the oven door. Which makes it easy to access to open, load and unload.  

I like the stone base with water channels - it is well designed to generate and retain steam.  Although I continue to fail to get holy grail oven spring and large ear, for the first time ever I got lovely blistering on the loaf surface. Prior to this I have tried ice cubes, water, spray top of loaf (like with baguettes) and never got the surface I got with the Fourneau.

When loading or moving the bread I found the front door (hatch) very easy to remove.  It is small and light, I just placed it on my lower oven rack when not on the Fourneau. 

It's pretty easy to get the hang of using the loading trays and tray tool.  They function surprisingly well. I thought it would be wobbly or awkward but it's not.

The trays come with silicone mats.  I have read that some people find just using parchment works better for them. The bottom of my loaves were not to dark or burned (may actually have been a bit light).  I did have burning with parchment in my dutch oven.  I may try parchment just to see what the difference may be.

For second half of bake, Fourneau recommends either removing the door or taking your bread out of the Fourneau and put it in oven.  I placed the Fourneau in the middle of the rack and there was not enough room to move the loaf.  So I wound up doing whole bake in Fourneau.  I could move it to one side - this would facilitate work flow for folks doing multiple loaves. (I'm still at the one loaf at a time phase till I get it right)

What is the downside?

Fourneau size may be a downside for some.  The Fourneau works for 500g loaves and all their recipes reflect this.  So anyone who wants large loaves - this would not work.  Or anyone who gets really great oven spring may find the aprox 5 3/4"H  x  9.5"W  clearance to be tight.

Where to store the Bread oven when not in use may be a challenge. 

 

Other Misc stuff:

I have only used a recipe from Fourneau so far and tomorrow I am going to bake FWSY overnight white.

I struggle with oven spring and being a geek I am deep into calculations for hydration and protein content.  I use all KA AP flour or a mix of KA AP and KA wheat in a 70/30% mix.  I use protein calculations to substitute gluten flour  to bring protein up to total of 14%. 

 

 

 

happycat's picture
happycat

Hello

Do you have any relationship with the company or its resellers?

Did you receive any discount or other consideration when acquiring this product?

Is this a paid / trade / discounted review?

I ask because it seems to be a trend on forums, people usually start posting with baking rather than a product review, and your avatar is masked.

WAbarb's picture
WAbarb

Hi @happycat

Totally understand your questions.  I never thought of this when posting.

No I don't have any relationship with the company or resellers.  I'm just a very bored retired IT professional (worked since early 90's till retirement for retailer who's name starts with car and ends with max) who took up baking bread during covid (so I'm a covid baker)

The only discount I got was the well known abandoned cart trick I frequently use. Set up account (so they have your email) put items you want in cart and leave them, then log out of site.  In a number of cases (usually next day) the retailer will send you an email with a discount (in this case it was 10%) to entice you to complete your purchase.  I tried to find another discount for the Fourneau but couldn't.  It's a pretty expensive investment so I was happy to get what I did.

My review is not paid for or reimbursed in any way by any company or anyone else.  I just really appreciate all of the info I have gotten from TFL users (great group) and I don't have enough experience to share any info about baking (maybe what not to do?🤣) .  When I got the Fourneau, I realized I could share this info since my TFL search didn't result in much on the Fourneau oven. Thought I could give back a little by sharing info on TFL.  Having an IT background, I am aware of all the sus posts that show up on forums - so I don't take any offence at your great questions.

My avatar is masked because I wanted to post an actual picture but still wanted to keep a little privacy.

now.... back to lurking and learning

Another Girl's picture
Another Girl

I haven't posted on this site in about a year, mainly because I haven't baked much – in no small part due to my inability to produce decent hearth loaves in my elderly gas oven. At some point, we're going to upgrade the electrical service in our (also elderly) home so we can install a dual-fuel oven that will hopefully be less efficient at venting steam. Until then, the Forneau Grande is a very, very good solution. I've only had the Forneau for three weeks, but the breads I've been pulling out if it have been gorgeous. I thought the handle and tray would be clunky to use, but it's smooth as buttah. I'm delighted with it so far.

I prefer the Forneau to the Challenger pan (which I also own) because the Forneau's size and shape are better suited to the deli ryes I bake most often and because the lid of the Challenger is, as you noted, heavy. Not taking anything away from the Challenger, I think it's a great pan; I just like the Forneau Grande better for my purposes. The Forneau costs more too, but is worth it in my opinion. I won't get into my issues with the Anova Precision Oven, which I have already posted about. 

One note I would make is that I suspect the 500g formulas on the company's site may have been sized for previous iterations of the Forneau oven, which were smaller. In any case, my last few bakes have been 750g and presented no issues. I'll goose the next one up to 800g and see how it goes.

TLDR: I agree with VAbarb and think the Forneau Grande is a great bread baker. I give it two floury thumbs up.

–AG

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

AG,   I have the earlier model Forneau, and yes, 500 grams of flour is an ideal size for that one, since the Grande is much bigger, I am not surprised it does better.  I can also chime in that the Forneau did really well for me, even though my version did not have the channels to pour water, and the top rests on a metal plate, not a stone as in the grande.  Subjectively, I think I get better ears withthe Forneau than the Lodge Combo cooker, that part of that may be the shape of the loaf.  

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

I reached out to AG to see if she could provide more feedback on her experiences with the Fourneau Grande, and as a result,  I bought one.    I got it yesterday, and my first results were quite good.  I bake 100% home milled wheat, sourdough boules,  so oven spring can be quite a challenge, and I almost never get an ear.  I was a bit concerned that the boule shape would not do well in the Fourneau Grande and also had a concern that I could not remove the bread from the oven and bake it on another rack, because my main use would be in a very small combi oven, that just barely fit the Fourneau.   Both concerns were overcome - the boule had a nice spring, and even developed a bit of an ear,  and while I took off the hatch half way through,  the loaf stayed in the Fourneau the entire time and the coloring of the loaf was fine.

A few notes, as AG told me in a private message,  some complain that you can't see the groove where the water is supposed to run , due to the bar across the front.  I had that problem and overfilled it a bit.  Second, if you used either of the prior versions  ( I have the first model which I bought used ) there was a steel plate, the cloche part rested on that, and a hatch slid forward  into the opening.    The new design uses a stone, and the front of the cloche part is on an angle, so that when you put on the hatch, it rests on the bar across the bottom, and tilts back and rests on the front of the cloche - so it works more like a lid on a DO, gravity holds it tight to the cloche.  I think that is a more elegant solution, though admit have good pot holders or heat resistant gloves comes in handy when taking the door off and putting it on.   Finally, I have not tried the aluminum tray, instead I loaded it right onto the stone using a diy version of a super peel.

Overally, I am pretty impressed.  Yes it is quite expensive,  but to me, at least so far, it seems to be worth it since I don't have to remove a hot top of a combo cooker during mid bake. 

Thanks again to AG for her help. 

idaveindy's picture
idaveindy

That loaf speaks to me.

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

Thanks,  not sure what it would say to you, but thanks.  

Another Girl's picture
Another Girl

I think it's saying "I'm delicious, have a slice or three!" 

I don't think it's possible to fill the water channel without some overspill, but it doesn't matter as long as you don't flood the thing. It doesn't require very much water and too much would probably be counter-productive, so my theory is that the channel is purposely shallow to keep users from overdoing it. I'm glad you are pleased with yours so far and hope you continue to be. Happy baking!

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

AG,  thanks,  I did overfill, and a little got under the loaf, which caused a bit of sticking.  When I tried the ice cube in a combo cooker in the past, the loaf got completely stuck to the cooker, so this design, as long as I don't overload it,  should avoid that problem. 

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

For those considering the Fourneau Grande,  they are having a sale starting Aug 26 - 10:00 am CST at   $100 off  on factory seconds.    The full text of the email is below.  I have been playing around with the Grande, and so far, am pretty pleased. Because I don't have space in the combi to finish cooking outside the cloche,  I don't use the aluminum tray with the silicone matt  ( when I did the first time ,  I didn't like how the bottom came out) and instead use a DIY version of a superpeel to load directly onto the stone.   While I bought the metal pitcher  that is used to add water to the small trough in the stone, and it does work, you could probably do just as well with a small spray bottle and spray inside the cloche just before you put on the lid.   While $225 is still pretty high, since it is similar to a DO, it does give you a little more option in terms of shapes,  and you don't have to mess with loading dough into a screaming hot DO.     No affiliation with the company , and I paid full price for mine, just wanted to give a heads up to anyone on the fence.  

 

 

We have a limited supply of Fourneau Grande bread ovens that work perfectly but that have less than perfect iron castings.

 

From August 26th through August 31st (or until supplies run out) we are offering "Seconds" kits at $225 – $100 below the MSRP.

 

If you've been looking for the absolute best deal on a Fourneau Grande, here it is. Casting imperfections are aesthetic, not functional, and may include scratches, bumps, small voids, or a newly machined edge in need of seasoning. Everything else in these kits is flawless and new.

 

Supplies are limited. Last year's "Seconds" sale was over in a matter of hours, so mark your calendar – August 26th, 2022 10AM CST

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

Just wanted to update, that while it is expensive, I am pretty happy with the Fournea Grande.  I tried adding water with the pitcher,  and also squirting water from a water bottle when loading a loaf, and on occasion had some loaves stick to the stone a bit.  ( I am not using the tray, which would avoid that problem, but I didn't like the bottom of the loaf when using the tray.  I have now switched to a very thin piece of steel, probably about 1/16 thick, that I treated with oil and heat a few cycles till it looked like a cast iron pan, and am getting good results whether I use the pitcher or a spray bottle  ( because the steel lifts the loaf just above the stone ) and no sticking .  This is 100% home milled whole wheat sourdough, no sifting.  

Another Girl's picture
Another Girl

Wow, great oven spring! The bread looks outstanding. Is it made with white wheat?

I'd love to see your steel and how it fits inside. Does it make it easier to pour water into the channel? I got a new range a few months ago and the Fourneau barely fits front to back. I thought of you when I saw the tight fit.

I'm really glad you are happy with it! I'd feel bad if you weren't.

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

Yes,  white wheat.  I have attached a photo - not much to see, just a piece of scrap i cut so that the bread would not stick to the stone when you pour water.  The outer groove is where the cast iron cloche sits, the inner groove is where you pour the water.   

Another Girl's picture
Another Girl

Nice! Easy access to the water channel. I over-poured recently and had some sticking, too. I wonder if my husband could fashion a piece of steel like that. Thanks for the photo!

jo_en's picture
jo_en

That is a beautiful 100% www loaf! Any special tips??

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

Sorry,  yes, my primary tip is luck.   So I have been using the same recipe, and a similar process for probably several years, and lately have made a few changes that have helped a bit.  First,  I slowly increased the hydration - I am now using 450 flour, 390 water, around 50 grams of 100 % hydration starter, for an overall 87% hydration.  Much earlier this year,  the water was around 360  so around 80% hydration.  The biggest factor, IMO ,  is the amount of rise during FP prior to putting it in the fridge.   I try to always make the same size loaf, so I can get a good idea of volume as it is resting in the banneton before I put it in the fridge.  If I put it in too early, it doesn't rise fully upon baking, and comes out more dense.  If I wait too long, it tends to deflate a bit when I score it.  The really hard part, for me, is that I have a pretty good idea of how high it should be in the basket before I put it in the oven, but guessing exactly how high it should rise before it goes into the fridge - knowing that it will continue to rise a bit more while it cools down in the fridge, it much more luck, at least for me.  This week's loaf was fine, but not as good as the one posted. I also found that an 1/8 tsp of Vit C reduces the chance of the dough weakening while in BF.  

jo_en's picture
jo_en

Thank-you for describing your  process and hydration. Deciding on extent of rise is where I am not consistent. I need more experience in this area. With clas or flas, I have not refrigerated.  Ending BF and going on to shaping  is where a judgment call is needed. Often I made the wrong judgment!

barryvabeach's picture
barryvabeach

Joe,  I have done rigorous experiments, but for me, the amount of rise in BF is not all that critical,  sometimes it is 75% sometimes closer to 100%.  For me, the most critical is the amount of rise during FP.  If i put it in the oven too early, I get spring lines on the bottom of the loaf and not much rise.  Too late, and while the bread is much more open, again, not much oven spring.  But the few times I get it right  . .  .   then that is magic. 

 

Edit,  Joe, sorry, I meant to say I have not done rigorous experiminents -   so I was saying I was not certain, but what seemed to me that made the most difference with whole wheat was the degree of final proof. 

jo_en's picture
jo_en

Hi,

Thank you for pointing out the difference. it will certainly help me!!