February 18, 2010 - 8:51am
Density
I'm new to baking bread and have a question about density. I have baked the bread from the recipe provided in lesson 2. This has turned our great several times, but, I'm wondering what the trick is to making it less dense. I'm looking for a good bread to use for Sub's.
Thanks,
Darren
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Comments
Hi Darren,
The two things you could do to this recipe to get a less dense crumb are 1.) add a little more water. Maybe 2 Tablespoons. and 2.) let the ferment go on until it really doubles and then shape and be sure it doubles again.
Also try to be gentle after the first (bulk) ferment. You want to try not to deflate it to much or you will have to wait until it again feels poofy. This is one of the areas in baking where you have to get a feel for it. Let us know how it goes.
You could also use All Purpose flour.
Eric
Thank you Eric and Jeff for your advice. I have a sick kid so I'm home for the day. I'm going to bake some bread using your advice.
Could I get your advice on something else?
I've read that sugar will "feed the yeast". I'm not exactly sure what that means. Will that take longer to rise then? Also, if I add sugar to a recipe and decide to add honey for additional flavor, should I reduce the amount of sugar due to the sugar in honey?
Thank you..
Darren
For less density in any recipe make certain that after the initial mixing and kneading that you always handle the dough gently so as to not completely deflate it. Add a bit of liquid to the recipe, do not use bread flour and make certain, as Eric said, that the dough is fully fermented and then fully proofed.
Using an instant read thermometer is also a good idea to make certain that the loaf is completely baked. You will not need the thermometer once you are familiar with a recipe and how it works in your oven. I always use a thermometer when working with unfamiliar recipes and find it to be a most valuable tool.
Jeff
Why is bread with all purpose flour less dense than with bread flour? What is the protein limit?
zdenka
Zdenka,
Here is a simple comparison, on one end of the scale is the dense and chewy bagel made with high gluten flour and on the other end of the scale is the light moist fluffy cake made with cake flour.
I could not put a number to what the limit might be but using my comparison you can see that a high protein flour is the wrong choice for a less dense crumb.
Jeff
I admit I have difficulty to imagine what "chewy" realy means. I have never eaten american bagel and I am not sure one can find original bagels in central Europe.
I have just thought that bread flour is always better for fermented dough and gluten structure. Well, the highest amount of protein i can find here is 12% for imported English "strong" flour. The czech bread flour has about 11,7 and AP (that many people use for bread, but only because if much lower price) has around 10,3g / 100g.
I usually mix bread, ww and rye flour, but i wonder whether I could save money and time and use AP instead of bread flour (which is not available in my small town) or whether it is worth trying increase the protein amount...
But thanks for your approach
zdenka
Zdenka,
Chewy in this case would be a crumb that takes some effort to bite through and requires far more actually chewing than a regular piece of bread. Often you see bagels being torn by the bite as they can be tough enough to require a combination of biting and simultaneously ripping the bagel apart. The common solution to this is to cut the bagel parallel to the circumference not across it.
I would definitely try your AP flour as it might work perfectly.
Jeff
I will stop being afraid and make a test to compare... I will let you know how works...
Still I ask myself the question why is bread flour ecommended in most recipes or sometimes even addition of VWG. What about when I always use at least 50% of other flours (ww, whole spelt, light or whole rye...)?
zdenka
Zdenka,
There are times that bread flour is appropriate. Breads with a lot of whole berries or other solid bits are a good example of a dough that may need more strength to hold it together. Also here (in the states, I don't know where you are) some AP flours have fairly high protein content making bread flour unnecessary. This gets into the inconsistency of the labeling of flours. Some AP flours are strong and some are not. I have used higher protein flours for pizza dough and bagels with fine results.
I regularly make a bread with 30% freshly milled whole grain rye and a small percentage of whole wheat and for the other 70% I always use AP flour with great success.
As for VWG, I have never used it and I see it as a shortcut to bypass proper gluten development in the dough.
Jeff
you really make things clearer to me.
As I have written above the czech bread flour has about 11,7% protein and AP has around 10,3%. Whole wheat flour ranges between 8-12%.
zdenka