The Fresh Loaf

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doctordough92's picture

On my quest to get better at batards, I baked FWSY's white 80% biga recipe and subbed 20% of the flour with WW. 

I'm finally getting some good scoring. I think my razor blade is too dull, I have to go back a second time through to get a decent score. I also think part of my issue with batards falling flat as soon as I get them in the oven has been to do with my proofing baskets. I think my batard bannetons are actually pretty small? ( When I've tried a whole 500g dough (half of a FWSY recipe), it almost seems like it's too much dough for the basket. Anyway, I've quartered the recipe so this is half the amount of called dough per loaf. 

Baked at 460 (per David's suggest when using a stone instead of DO with FWSY) for 15 minutes covered and 20 uncovered. 


alfanso's picture

Earlier this month, Joze (joc1954) posted his Barley-Rye Bread, a lovely dense nutty boule.  Having a bag of barley on hand but never using it before, I decided to give it a go.  But, as with my usual linear uncircular bread self, as baguettes.

According to Joze's write-up the dough takes no autolyse, has a long bench rise for a warm kitchen (3 1/2 hours) and a long retard (20 hours).  At 75% hydration this dough is quite dense and was difficult to French Fold without the flours soaking in an autolyse for at least 30-60 minutes or more.  Letter Folds every 45 minutes.  The dough remained stiff and fought being stretched and eventually shaped at every moment of its existence.  Neither extensible nor elastic, it just was...

Halfway through the bulk retard I shaped and placed it on a couche, still dense and stiff, but workable and required only the slightest amount of flour on the bench and couche.  Back into retard and baked about 21 hours after it first entered he refrigerator.  Scoring was simple.  450dF, 13 minutes with steam, and another 13 minutes after rotating, with a final 2 minutes venting.

And like Forrest Gump's box of chocolates, I didn't know what I'd get, how the bake would turn out, how much grigne or how open the crumb would be.  Oven spring was somewhat minimal but with a fine grigne and the crumb remained particularly dense.  I'll say that was due to having to be manipulated with heavy hands in order to pre-shape and shape the dough - a lot more so rather than to simply ball the dough up for a boule.  A lot denser than Joze's boule. 

A very "wheaty" taste, a bit addictive in fact.  40% bread flour, 30% rye, 30% barley.  75% hydration with 10% pre-fermented rye flour in 100% hydration levain.  I would have preferred a darker bake, but for a first foray in the barley-rye playpen, I remained on the cautious side of the playground.

4x300g baguettes/long batards

leslieruf's picture

Yesterday was the last day to top up bread for the next week plus leave some in  the freezer for when we return.

So Sunday overnight refreshed the starter, then Monday made 2 builds, converting it to 100% hydration and using bran for the 2nd build.  2nd & 3rd builds combined as we were going to be out until evening.  Before going to bed built the levains required for my bake.

Hamelman"s 5 grain Levain (pictured)


Flaxseed 62 g

cracked rye 62 g

sunflower seed 52 g

Rolled oats 52 g

salt 5 g

Boiling water 276 g


Bread flour 169 g

Water 211 g (yes 125% hydration)

Mature starter seed 34 g

Final Dough

Hi gluten flour 338 g (I used bread flour + 11 g gluten to approximate 13.5% protein)

Wholewheat flour 169 g

Water 175 g

Salt 12.2 g

All the soaker

All the levain


Monday afternoon weighted out the seeds, gave the flaxseeds a quick grind in the coffee grinder so it was a mix of fine and coarse. I use jumbo rolled oats so gave them a quick chop the toasted all the grains and left to cool.  Amazing smell.  I haven't used toasted seed in this amount before.

Monday night before bed mixed the levain and left on bench.  Mixed the soaker allowed to cool then covered it.  It soaked up all the liquid very quickly.

Tuesday morning room temperature is 21 deg C.  Added water and soaker to the levain, mixed well then added to flour and salt mix. Mixed with stretch and folds until all incorporated.  It was pretty sticky and much firmer than I remember from the other occasions I have made  this. Left to rest for 10 minutes then did some for stretch and folds.  I added 2 tspn water (about 6 g) at this point as I felt it was a bit too firm. Left to rest. I did 3 more stretch and folds over next 3 hours then left to finish bulk ferment. 

This is after 2nd lot of stretch and folds. 

2 hours later I divided the dough and preshaped, it had increased maybe 40%. 

I left it for 45 minutes but it didn't relax hugely, but was easy to shape into 2 batards. Turned the oven on to preheat DOs. This time I bench proofed and about an hour or so later it was looking poofy so popped them into the oven 15 mins lid on at 250 deg and then 20 minutes lid off.  I kept the convection on during this bake to keep oven temperature up and it seemed to help. 

Here is the 2nd batard.  After my recent experiences with Tartine style Country Champlain the shaping, scoring etc was a breeze.

and of course, the crumb shot. 

Very happy camper!

At the same time I made 3 small (300 g) 1:2:3 sourdough boules.   I found this was a very firm dough as well, much more so than normal.  I have opened a new bag of gluten flour (from a different source) and I really wonder  if that is influencing things so much.  I am adjusting my 11% protein flour to 12.5% but previous bakes have been much wetter. 

These had 4 x 10 stretch and folds, 2 hour BF followed by 20 mins preshape  with about a 2 -3  hour proof. 

No crumb shot, these were frozen as is.

The final part of the bake was Trevor Wilson's Champlain.  I will post details on  "Anyone interested in a Champlain SD bake?" shortly.

The day went well, it was busy and I was on a schedule to get it all baked before I went out to a 7 pm meeting.  lol, hubby had to take the final 1:2:3 loaf which was the final one, out for me.   I am happy with the crumb from the 5 grain levain as this has such a lot of grain, but I think it is the best I have baked this bread!


rudirednose's picture

the loaf

detail crust

 detail crust

detail cracks

 detail crust - cracks



detail crumb center

 detail crumb center

detail crumb rim

 detail crumb rim

Here is the original!

I worked along the original formula as near as possible. But some little deviations had to be done.

First of all, as I always do, with 500 g total flour.

I have no white seed-starter, so I used my rye starter @ 100%, and, for longer ripening-time, only 20 g - 4 %.

I have no durum berries for milling, so I used coarse durum flour, normaly for pasta making. This worked fine with other breads bevore.

Instead of fresh milled WW I used a reminder coarse WW flour witch had a lot of bran in it. But now it is gone! ;-)

I took 5 g fresh yeast - 1 %, as most time.

During the first mixing after autolyse I had only a wet batter in my bowl, so I decided to add 20 g VWG - 4 %.

After adding the seasalt the dough got strength, after adding the yogurt the strength got better, after the olive oil one more.

Bulk for 1.5 h with s&f direct, and after 30 and 60 mn.

Shaping was difficult, but here on TFL I read an articel, that helped me a lot! So I gave to the dough 3 x 2 "tour simple" during 30 mn. Then into the linned and well dusted banneton and for 7 h into the fridge at 4C/39F.

Baking similar to here.

Waited until next morning bevor slicing.

This bread is gorgeous!Thank you, Ian!

Fine but complex taste, crisp crust, deliciouse crumb, super for sandwiches.

Next time I will try to mill my own Durum!

Happy baking




pul's picture

I have been quite busy lately, but haven't stopped baking. By the way, is it my impression or the number of posts has increased significantly lately? I can't keep up with so much information anymore. 

Baked two loaves this weekend, a record batch for me. Both 75% hydration and 20% levain. Some mixed cold bulk fermentation and cold proofing. Top loaf was 25% dark rye + 5% red fife, while the lower loaf 20% dark rye. The lower loaf was given as gift, so no crumb shot. The pic below is for the crumb shot of the top loaf along with my lunch yesterday.




nmygarden's picture

Hi All,

A brief post to share today's bake, a SD multigrain loaf (and a BIG one at that) with a bit of spice to it, plus olives and roasted red peppers. Flours and grains combined AP and BF, whole rye flour, barley flakes, and wheat germ, plus add-ins including multicolor quinoa (cooked), stuffed green olives and roasted red peppers (and the olive oil they were cooked with). I used Old Bay Seasoning (at 2.5%) for the salt and extra spices.

This may have been the largest loaf I've made - dough weight >2K. My cloche dome wouldn't have possibly covered it, so I fashioned a cover from aluminum foil - worked just fine. Baked 20 minutes covered @450 F, then 40 minutes uncovered @425 F.

I'm very pleased with the result - the crumb is soft and open, the crust is thin, but has some chewiness to it, and the flavor is well-rounded and savory. If I try this one again, I'll probably scale it back a bit, or divide the dough into smaller loaves.

Happy baking, Everyone!

doctordough92's picture

I made KAF's March baking along recipe - Gruyere stuffed mini loaves.

While they may not look like much in this pic, these turned out to be an awesome cheese-filled volcano. I divided the dough into 4 per the "mini loaf" sizes but they were much too big for one person so we cut them in half. Also, instead of the starter they prescribed with dry active yeast overnight, I used equal weight sourdough starter (although I'm sure my hydration wasn't equal). I also did half Gruyere and half Pecarino Romano. I didn't have pizza seasoning on hand so I made my own - equal parts dried basil, dried oregano, and dried thyme. 

Perfect flavors and perfect cheesiness. I would say that in order to better hold the shape, I would roll my dough log tighter before cutting them. A skewer may even help to hold the tight coil while it bakes. I also thought mine could have risen more in the oven, it was a touch dense in the end. I may choose to proof it longer next time. 

I would almost say that 10 oz of cheese is a bit too much. While I never imagined saying that, it may be true in this case. I'll try 8 oz next time. A blend of parmesan and asiago may be nice to try as well. 

doctordough92's picture

Having been baking for 2 months and several mediocre baguette attempts, I've finally executed a sub-par baguette with an A+ recipe - SJSD baguettes from dmsnyder. 

The recipe is great. A nice blend of WW and all purpose (I didn't have the rye on hand to use but will next time). I recently purchased a baguette pan from a baking store that has three wells with many holes to cook baguettes on. What I found was that the three I baked on the pan did not brown on the bottom but the remaining one baguette that I baked on a sheet was slightly browned on the bottom. 

I was impressed with the forty-five degree scores. I would, however, like to have them open up more like dmsynder's did. The crust was great, though. I steamed with a preheated cast iron and boiling water for the first ten minutes. 

I believe there is a size issue here. While these are good length, they are fairly skinny and haven't beefed up like dmsynder's have. What can I do to make sure these not only rise but expand out and bulk up? Did I not proof them long enough? I also have splitting at my seam underneath which makes me think it may have under-proved as well. 

Danni3ll3's picture


Making sprouted flour is something that I have been curious about so I slightly adapted one of Dab’s recipes from last summer. And since I used Trevor’s pre-mix method earlier this week and had good success with it, I decided at the last minute to use the same method for this bread. 

That wasn’t my original plan since I was going to use part yeast water, dump everything together except for the salt and the levain, let sit while the levain did its thing and then mix in the last two ingredients. I had to give up the yeast water since I wasn’t sure what would happen having it sit overnight and then adding the levain and the add-ins. The yeast water will have to wait for another time. 

Makes 3 loaves

29 g each of Kamut, Spelt, Rye, Red Fife and Selkirk wheat berries (to be sprouted and milled into flour)

26 g each of Kamut, Spelt, Rye, Red Fife and Selkirk wheat berries (to be sprouted and used whole)

957 g unbleached flour

50 g freshly ground flax seeds

100 g dried cranberries

100 g shelled pistachios

30 g yogurt

735 g filtered water

22 g salt

305 g of 100% hydration levain (method is included in recipe)

  1. A few days before making the dough, weigh out 29 g each of Kamut, Spelt, Rye, Red Fife and Selkirk wheat berries for a total of 145 g. Soak them for 4 hours and then drain. Rinse and drain every 8 or so hours until the berries show three little white rootlets buds. This took 30 hours. Spread a thin layer of sprouts evenly in a dehydrator lined with window screen (so the berries don’t fall through while drying) and dry for 3 hours. Weigh the dehydrated berries to ensure that you have roughly 145 g which let you know that they are dry enough to be milled. Mill the berries and reserve for the levain. 
  2. Use the same method to sprout 26 g each of the same grains (Kamut, Spelt, Rye, Red Fife and Selkirk wheat berries). I sprouted these a little bit longer but I try not to have the rootlet grow longer than the berry itself. Refrigerate until dough making day. Bring to room temperature before using in the dough.
  3. A day or two before making dough, revive your starter so that it is active. I did several feedings 10 - 12 hours apart.
  4. Early in the evening before, mix the water with the flour, ground flax and the salt into a shaggy dough. Put into the fridge for a few hours.
  5. Toast the pistachios in a dry frying pan and reserve along with the dried cranberries. The pistachios toasted really quickly so they really to be watched closely. 
  6. Before going to bed, take the dough out of the fridge and let warm up to room temperature overnight on the counter. 
  7. Also before going to bed, feed 25 g of your starter with 140 g filtered water and all of the sprouted 5 grain flour. It doubled overnight and was ready in the morning (8 hours).
  8. First thing in the morning, mix the levain and yogurt with the dough. With the first batch of dough, I did a few minutes of slaps and folds to mix in the levain and then the add-ins but I felt like I was tearing the dough, so the next 3 were all done inside the bucket using folding and rolling. I let the dough rest a few times to let it relax and allow me to continue without ripping it. Once the levain is well mixed in, add the pistachios, cranberries and sprouts, and continue the folds to get everything integrated. Let rest for an hour. 
  9. Then do 2-3 sets of stretches and folds an hour apart. Place the dough in a warm spot and let it rise about 50% or maybe a tad more. 
  10. To release the dough from the bucket, I wet my hand and ran it all the way around and under the dough, rewetting as necessary. Then I made sure one side of the bucket was wet and slid the dough out on that side. The whole thing stayed intact without deflating. 
  11. Sprinkle a bit of flour on the mass and divide into 3 boules of about 840 g. Pre-shape gently into rounds without deflating the dough. Let rest 1 hour and then shape using the cinching method. Tighten and round out the boules by pulling the dough on the counter.
  12. Place seam side down into rice/ap floured bannetons, cover, proof on the counter for another hour, and put to bed for the night in the fridge.
  13. The next morning, about 15 hours later, heat up the oven and the Dutch ovens to 475 F for 45 minutes to an hour. Place parchment rounds in the bottom of the hot pots, score and place the dough inside and cover. Scoring isn’t usually my thing but I found my lame and scored the loaves even though they were seam side up. 
  14. Bake at 425 F for 25 minutes. Uncover and then bake for a further 20 minutes. I usually bake at 450F for the first part but thought I would try a lower temp to bake a bit less dark as often the loaves with fruit in them end up with an almost burnt bottom. It worked like a charm!
  15. Cool and enjoy!


I got pretty decent oven spring considering all the add-ins in these loaves. They sure smell heavenly! Crumb shot when we cut one open. 

Bread1965's picture

Well, this is my sixth attempt at making a more open crumb per Trevor's book. I'm not getting the wide open crumb Trevor does, but I'm enjoying some mighty good breads along the way. This is this weekend's bake.. first the pictures.

This loaf was made with 100g of 100% hydration AP flour starter at peak, 200g water, 285g flour (70% bread flour, 30% whole wheat) and 6g fine sea salt. I gave the flour an hour autolyse before adding the starter and salt. I gave the dough three sets of stretch and folds thirty minutes apart. Aside from the initial mixing of the starter into the flour/water, the three stretch and folds sets were each four simple quarter turn of the bowl stretch and folds. I tried to build structure but keep it gentle.

From adding the starter I let it bulk for a total of almost seven hours to get it to a double of the dough.  I then tried to pour the dough onto the bench as gently as possible, but it deflated somewhat. I gave it a simple and gentle pre-shape and let it rest for ten minutes. I then shaped and loaded it into a basket. But I could also tell that the shaping process deflated the dough as well. I think next time I'm going to dramatically reduce bulk and leave most of the expansion to happen in the basket to reduce touching the dough after most of it's rise. Let's see if that helps. I loaded it in the the fridge for about 10 hours before the bake this morning. Here's the crumb..

The crumb is gently moist, has good body to it and great mouth feel. It's a very nice bread.. I'm getting there..

Bake happy.. bread1965!



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