December 16, 2019 - 10:16pm
I can only laugh about this
My first attempt at baking on a baking stone.
This was a very low hydration dough, about 60%, which I left to rise overnight in the refrigerator. I left it out for 20 minutes before baking it. I sprayed water inside the oven twice, once when I put the dough in the oven and once more four or five minutes later.
I'm guessing that the problem may have been caused by the difference in temperature between the baking stone and the dough.
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Miller, I can see some SERIOUS potential here! You got crazy oven spring. If you can only harness that...
Did you score the bread? I can’t see.
Also, Im wondering if you didn’t allow the skin of the dough to dry out in the fridge.
Tell us more about this beast.
Danny
The baking stone is not your problem. Many bakers, including myself, load cold (un-warmed) dough onto a super hot stone with great results. I always bake that way.
I did score the bread, but the depth of scoring was limited because the skin was very dry. After baking there was a very shallow sign of my scoring on the surface of the bread. Actually I’m confused about this point. When I leave my dough in the fridge should I try to keep it moist in the banneton or not?
Could the air current from the convection fan have hardened the "shell" and prevented proper expansion? Did the dough burst as much out the back side as the front side? It looks like it's sitting right in front of the fan.
I believe that the fan works even when using the bread baking setting, but I’m not entirely sure about this. When baking in a Dutch oven this is not an issue an thatks why I never considered it so far.
If you have a metal bowl or roasting pan of the right size, I would suggest using that first. My inclination/guess is that the fan is more to blame than drying out in the fridge.
By the way, was the baking stone pre-heated?
I preheated it to 230 C and I reduced the oven temperature gradually.
Miller, if the bottom of your breads are not burning, I am of the opinion that any heat from the stone is great. At this time I think the heat from the stone produces oven spring. It is heat from the top that concerns me more. I say that because if the crust browns (hardens) too early, the spring and ear and crumb will be compromised. The hard crust will allow further expansion.
IMO, too much heat is not a present concern for you.
I read that you did score the bread. We could use more images, if you have them. How about a top shot?
Did the dough retard uncovered in the fridge and maybe dry out?
You wrote, “ I did score the bread, but the depth of scoring was limited because the skin was very dry. After baking there was a very shallow sign of my scoring on the surface of the bread.” This seems to indicate that a dried out skin caused the beast. With that much oven spring the score line and bloom should have been very open and/or wide.
Danny
The baked Vesuvius is in the trash. Hence no photos unfortunately...
The bottom of the bread was actually less browned than when I used the Dutch oven on previous occasions. This time the top of the bread must have been quite dry, as I mentioned. The dough was kept overnight in a banneton in the fridge and was covered with a towel. I feared that by keeping it in a plastic bag there would be too much moisture and it wouldn’t come out of the banneton. I’ve had this happen to me in the past at least twice.
What would be a good temperature to heat the baking stone?
500F or so is good. I would bag the retarded dough in the future. The top of the dough gets wets, but the liner and/or the cane absorb a lot of moisture from the bottom. Rice flour works well to prevent sticking.
To an artisan baker, a "bread baking setting" on a convection oven is basically useless unless he/she knows exactly what that means, i.e., "what changes? And to what does it change?" when that setting is selected.
We have so many ways to bake bread other than in the traditional bread loaf pan. Were the designers thinking of baking bread in a loaf pan? Or were they thinking the consumer was going to bake a bare boule on a stone? What, exactly, is the situation for which they designed "bread baking setting"? Hopefully, reading the manual will explain. Otherwise we can assume: consumer appliance designers design to the most common type of, or "average," consumer.
If your oven has no exposed lower element, and _has_ to use forced air circulation to move the heat from a hidden element to the baking chamber, then that is a different story than a conventional electric oven with a lower exposed element. (We can see the upper elements in your photo.) If you do not have an exposed lower element, and _have_ to use at least some degree of forced air, I would suggest then always using some kind of cover, either a) a dutch oven, b) an inverted metal bowl, c) a covered thin metal roaster, d) an inverted roaster.
This is calling for a bread exorcist!
But as others already said, the top crust set too fast, causing the rest to burst out the bottom. Next time I would recommend putting a bowl with hot water in the oven with the bread for the first 15-20 min. (take it out when the crust starts to brown a little). The steam causes the oven temperature to be lower for a longer time (since water evaporates at 100°C), giving the gases longer opportunity to expand before the crust sets.
It appears so, as you say. The weakest point was the bottom part since the top part had dried out in the fridge. I did consider putting a bowl with hot water, but it was too late. :(
A pic of the other side of the bread would give a hint as to whether it was the fan. The "crown" is brown, but the upper front side (below the crown) is firm and pale not brown. If the corresponding back side is browner than the pale and stiff front side, that would tend to indicate the fan played a part.
Loaves in the fridge are usually covered with a shower cap or put in plastic bags to keep the moisture in.
Unfortunately I didn’t take a photo of the hidden side. However, I remember turning the bread about 90 degrees when I noticed the eruption in the oven.
i just did some very cursory research on the "CircoTherm" oven, just the marketing material, not the manual.
Absent any _specific_ instructions in the manual on baking "bare boules" on a stone, It looks like you will need to cover your loaf and not bake it "bare". It's the forced air that is drying out the boule and forcing expansion through the less-baked bottom.
i would venture that the manual has a section on baking bread. but if that section is based solely on baking bread in a conventional loaf pan, then you will need to ignore it for baking bread in any other way. I would be pleasantly surprised if it contains instructions for artisan bread, baked open/bare on a stone. Though the marketing material does indicate there is a pizza setting, it would not be the same.
By the way, you needn't throw a ruined loaf in the trash. the birds will eat it, as long as it is not raw dough. Just let it finish baking.
what an adventure. I do envy your fancy oven though.
Thank you for your comments. They have been very helpful, if not only for the fact that I should have read the Manual (RTFM comes to mind)!
The Table below from the Manual shows information about baking bread. According to this I have baked the bread at a much higher temperature than was necessary. Maybe I was also baking bread at too high a temperature in my Dutch oven too in recent weeks and probably using the wrong setting (Bread baking instead of Circotherm or Top-Bottom heating).
There is no other relevant information in the Manual, for example about baking on a pizza stone, but elsewhere it specifies that the bread baking settings are for 180º C to 240º C.
I'm a bit unsure about the baking times given in the Table. They are shorter than what most recipes suggest.
I can vouch that this oven does bake excellent pizza on a pizza stone. I've only tried it twice so far and the result was perfect. I believe that homemade pizza can be much healthier than store bought. I also baked Pavlovas in it and I surprised myself at how well they turned out. You wouldn't believe it given my performance with sourdough. :)
Ideally I wanted to buy an oven with a steam feature, but the ones that I saw when I was looking what was available were either too expensive or not so convenient for other uses.
it also looks a little underproofed like it could have expanded more before retarding. Dropping the hydration can often test patience as the rises may take longer. I do agree that the crust most likely dryed out in the fridge. I'm not a fan of long bouts in the banneton. As suggested, bag it in paper or plastic to slow down the drying effects of the banneton and the refrigerator. A cross section of the crumb might have been interesting.
The pale bottom on the dough (now on the side) that first hit the stone makes me think underproofed as it looks like it cracked and gave birth soon after contact with the stone. The dried crust kept it from reaching proof.
My suggestion if it ever happens again that the dough is too leather hard after tipping out from the banneton, either flip the loaf again putting the banneton side down on the stone Or cut concentric circles around the median of loaf or a big spiral so it can rise like jiffy pop popcorn. The stiff crust bands work like stays or ribs on the outside of the loaf as the dough spreads and rises under the cuts. Use a very pointy scissors if crust is too leathery. A big starburst with a lot of points (16?) might also bake out nicely.
Whatever I read and saw which advocated leaving the dough uncovered in the fridge did not actually work for me. Therefore I'll be putting the banneton inside a plastic bag when retarding the dough in the fridge. Anyway, I would prefer not to do a long retard in the fridge, at least at my initial stage of learning, but sometimes the timing of the whole process doesn't help me. I hope that once I get things working more successfully I'll be able to adjust my schedule accordingly.
Your guess that the dough may be underproofed could be right, because when I sliced the bread it had large holes in it, but the rest of it was very dense and rather chewy. At the time I thought that this may have been because it didn't have a proper oven spring.
I'll be more inventive with the scoring next time, if need be, and thank you for the suggestions.
I'll take a few weeks off baking, but all being well I should be back stronger and even more determined early next year.