The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

50/50 Cold Bulk Fermentation

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

50/50 Cold Bulk Fermentation

A while ago Joze created an amazing version of Maurizio's 50/50 during a community bake which I loved doing at the time ..http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/56967/50-wholewheat-community-bake-jozes-version

I wanted to have another look at cold bulk as I can bulk ferment dough for let's say 5 loaves or more without the need to have a retarder or fridge to host all the bannetons...so cold bulk overnight and then pre-shape, final shape, ambient proof and bake is my aim...

Joze's shaping approach is a bit like a ciabatta and I wanted to change it a bit more into a loaf that I could score...

So.. 25g liquid starter, 50g WW Shipton Mill Canadian WW, 50g Marriages Organic Strong White

7:00 and was ready at 12:00 after 5 hours..

AL 9:00 - 400g Shipton Mill Canadian , 400g  Marriages Organic Strong White and 560g water

12:00 Add levain and flour, 60g water - Rubaud 

12:30 Add 18g salt and 60g water dough temp 25C and slap and folds until almost fully developed not quite yet...

Then into proofer at 80F and three coil folds at 30 min and there was some nice activity and fermentation along side creases from last fold were still slightly visible..ready for the fridge, I thought...

Put in wine cooler at 4C 15:00

Took dough out at 7:00AM  and dough temp was 6C...I know my wine cooler does not quite give me the accurate temp..always a bit warmer..

Pre-shape with cold dough and surprised to feel air in it...

45 min bench rest 

Final Shape and into banneton - and then room temp proof for one hour and 15 min...This is the bit where I always  loose my nerve! Can I go longer?

Not to unhappy with the result but wonder to try similar approach with a stiff leaven from my 100% starter and what difference I get in taste and dough strength...

If anyone has some great references or tips for cold fermentation, plesae let me know... Happy baking... Kat

Dough when put into wine cooler..after 3 X 30 min folds

Dough coming out of wine cooler in the morning after 15 min, dough temp 6C and hate to prick the chap...

Dough straight out of wine cooler before pre-shape

pre-shape of cold dough

scored..

 

 

Comments

hreik's picture
hreik

loaf of bread.  My goodness!!!!!  just stupendous

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

so much and I really must bake more with ambient proofing and scoring...very scary...However, if I am able to do this consistently then I will be able to have  a larger amount dough in cold bulk and no need for long retarding..separate fridge but just proofing on couche eventually...🙏Kat

Danni3ll3's picture
Danni3ll3

I know what you mean by losing your nerve when it comes to proofing. That’s a big reason why I cold proof my loaves. 

You got your proof down perfectly. That is an amazing crumb! Well done!

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

proofing whether retard or ambient is really difficult to judge and tune......more to learn..and eat! Kat

Bread1965's picture
Bread1965

Very well done! Love the crumb and process.

How much rubaud and slap / fold.. always wonder how long I should of the rubaud..

yum.. frank!

 

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

mainly to incorporate levain and dough after the AL. Just enough to feel that the dough is getting strength and a bit of air when you get that it is coming of the bowl more easily and not sticky anymore feeling.. then rest for 30 min to give the yeast a change to get started in proofer at 75F or more temp...

After that I add the salt and more water and really pinch the dough like scissors.... it first comes apart and then I use just a bit of Rubaud for it do come together again before slap and folds...Maurizio did a nice version of slap and folds on his blog and aim to get dough nicely developed but not to full windowpane...if you think the dough tears then rest and let it relax and the dough also might be ready...I don't count my slaps or time it but just see when I get  that smoother and stronger feeling and not too strong so that dough does not tear...I hope this makes sense...

I have found that especially with larger amounts of dough I am not able to get the dough developed enough with Rubaud as I am just a wimp! So I use Rubaud mainly to incoprorate really and then wack it with slap &  folds...Ha, Ha...

Happy baking Frank... Kat

Elsie_iu's picture
Elsie_iu

Although you're not completely happy with the bake, I can assure you that the bread is gorgeous! Nice bake, Kat!

I never let the dough cold bulk ferment due to time reason so I can't offer any advice regarding the subject. The idea sounds interesting though. Surely I'll give it a try...but not before I buy a larger fridge :)

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

if you want to make more loaves but don't have the fridge space Elsie....because you just rest the tub in the fridge for bulk and not 5 bannetons or more ..later during retarding in fridge, if that makes sense.

I love the way there are so many options to make baking work around everyone's life! So many stories to tell.... Thank you  Elsie...Kat

 

Elsie_iu's picture
Elsie_iu

I mix the dough in a huge salad mixing bowl and I'm often too lazy to transfer it to a smaller container. That's why to me: cold bulk = huge salad mixing bowl; cold retard = 1 banneton... Of course I was too silly to think of it this way. All I've to do is to switch to a tiny box :)

DesigningWoman's picture
DesigningWoman

that made beautiful loaves. Did you make five of these? 

I'm coming to really like a cold bulk ferment, and I totally hear you about wondering if you can push the proof longer. Even having adopted the small lump of dough in a straight -sided container, I'm still not sure how far I can push.

But you've nailed it, that is some very appetizing bread just screaming out for some butter!

Keep on baking, Kat!

Carole 

Oh, one thing: that's 60g of water you add with the salt, right? And not flour? ☺

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

and I corrected my mistake with the flour... Doh....

Please share any findings on your cold bulks and I must try that small lump of dough in small container. My sister gets her jams in  Germany in those very cute small Weck glasses and they would be ideal for that!  I also find those videos from the EIDB so useful but the chap, (is he called Thomas) seems to be with the San Francisco Baking Institute now and just spotted him in an IG post yesterday...what a small world?  I am still considering getting my hands on French T80 flour and might get it to be posted to Mum in Germany and then schlepp it back on my next visit to save on postage! The things we do!!!!  Kat

DesigningWoman's picture
DesigningWoman

I just PM'd you to not hijack the thread.

And yes, I'm actually thinking about a bake for Friday afternoon/evening, so will keep you posted on the bulk retard. But there will be all kinds of other variables going on too, so conclusions, if any, can only be considered tentative…

Keep on baking!

PS, yes, I believe his name is Thomas; did you know that he was some kind of scientist (perhaps a biologist, but I'm no longer sure) before being bitten by the bread bug? I'l have to take a look. Would it be the SFBI Instagram?

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bum47F9AVqJ/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=fiklalkl6m00

and you need to swipe..how I would love to do a course with either schools! Good luck with the bake!  Kat

pul's picture
pul

I have been using cold bulk fermentation because it is not as critical as retarding shaped loaves. I have had lots of flops retarding shaped loaves because my fridge is not that cold.

I bookmarked this post because the result was quite stunning.

peter

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

about your fridge being too warm as I had exactly that problem when I started baking without realizing that I was over-proofing my doughs in the fridge!!!

Now I have a little wine cooler that is 4C but with the dough needing time to cool down when I measured the dough temp after 15 hours in there it was 6C...so my wine cooler it obviously a bit warmer than the 4C it tells me too! Let me know how you get on and I am still learning...

I used this much water only this time as it was a strong Canadian WW flour and if I were to use different flour from UK  I would be more conservative or treat it a bit more like ciabatta without scoring and resting on couche and bake (like Joze's amazing formula) ...but I wanted on purpose to have a more 'stiff' dough to be able to score with an ambient proof...

I shall try this one again..maybe one with a stiff WW levain 65% and the other with a 100% 50/50 levain and see what I find?  Kat

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

get to work on the dough for a long time in the warm and cold so the bread will be as flavorful as it can be with sour and tang - and great tasting bread is what bread making is all about!  Plus the shaped proof doesn't over proof in the fridge while you are sleeping either:-)  The first one I remember using a cold bulk ferment was PR from about 25 years ago so it isn't that old of a thing.  Lucy calls it cutting edge and one of the many reasons we are living in the golden age of sourdough bread making, it has never been this good - with sleeping ferrets lying around everywhere.  This is a fine example of a great bread that could only exist right now - so enjoy!

Happy baking Salty!

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

to plug up the courage and do this for 4 or 5 loaves and have them all room proof on the couche!  This will also go along with a nice shaping challenge as I love that longer oblong shape of a batard ideal for couche proofing....If did have a more sour taste indeed and I was wondering whether this is about the WW or the longer cold bulk...? Well, need to bake it another time without cold bulk and compare....  Kat

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

promote sour.  Cold does the tang part of bread  A SD without tang is only half as good as one with both base sour and that acetic kick.

cfraenkel's picture
cfraenkel

I love the fact that you use the wine cooler for your dough.  My oven is the worst, so I can never get that lovely dark crust or the bottom of the loaf is burnt beyond recognition. (I've tried every trick in the book to no avail, so I go for golden ;-)

 

not.a.crumb.left's picture
not.a.crumb.left

looks totally fantastic! Kat