Sherri,

I currently own the 5 qt. Viking and have been very happy with it. Its got a smaller motor (800 watt versus 1000 watt) than the one you're considering, but that's not been an issue for me. I've used it to mix bagel dough using KA high-gluten flour and it hasn't been fazed by that in the slightest. I've had mine for a little over a year now and have had no regrets about purchasing it.

-brian

Sherri,

  I've been using a kitchen-aid stand mixer for years now, It's one notch below the professional model. I believe 475 watts, 6 qt bowl, if memory serves me well. I usually make two or three loaves at a time and have never had any problems. I would think it would be a lot more economical! Good luck with whatever brand you decide on!

Camochef

I bake one or two loaves at a time (full-size equivalent) or use it for miscellaneous baking tasks like cookies.  My KitchenAid Classic does me fine.  But I read the manual and make sure I'm not doing more than the machine can handle.  For example, I don't use more flour than is recommended, and I don't knead at a higher speed than recommended.  I can only suspect that ruined machines result from unheeded manuals.  You should be able to read the manual online before you buy and see if the machine can handle your needs.

Rosalie

The Viking 7 Qt is somewhat pricey for a mixer especially if your are just starting out.

Of course I don't know how much baking your are planning on doing. The reviews on Amazon are not glowing either. I have never used the Viking myself.

I know that several professional baking book authors are using the Kitchen Aid K 5 or K 6 series. The heavy duty model, not the weaker *Artisan* model usually on display in the cookware depts of retail stores.

I hope others post with their experience and that may help you decide.

Stephen 

NM

No matter which stand mixer you finally choose, do take the time to study its manual and understand the operating limits of the machine.

I have one of the "weaker" KA Artisan mixers and am quite happy with it. It can handle up to 12 cups of flour, which exceeds my baking needs for my small household.

I purchased the KA online and paid $160 less than local retailer pricing (shipping was free). Do online research into the various brands and read the owner reviews before you make any final decision. Good luck in your quest.

Sherri, 

I haver a 5 qt. Kitchen Aid that's 20 years old, which I use frequently (3-4 times a week) and it still works great.  It was made by Kitchen Aid Div. of Hobart in Troy Ohio.  I must tell you they don't build them like this one is built anymore.  To compensate for the 5 qt. bowl limitation I have 2 bowls, so I can mix 2 batches of dough in the same baking session.  Let me say that I know nothing about the Viking mixers so can't comment on them.  Don't know how committed you are to baking or how much money you have to invest in a mixer, but if I were going to replace my K.A., in additon to the Viking, I would seriously look at both the Bosch Universal Plus and the Electrolux DLX.  Check the SEARCH funtion on this site for both the Universal Plus and the DLX, there's a number of postings on both these mixers and perhaps the Viking too, I didn't SEARCH Viking.  I'm probably going to get booed for saying this, but I wouldn't buy one of the low-end K.A. mixers.  If you are serious and committed to bread baking you're going to want a machine that has excess power and capacity and will last you for many years to come.  The U. Plus and the DLX are more expensive and more powerful than the newer low-end K.A.s and from what I have read, the users, for the most part, seem to really like these machines.  If memory serves me correctly, the DLX has a slightly larger capacity.  Anyway, my suggestion is to go online and look at the specs for all the machines you're interested in and read some of the user comments from this site. I don't think you'll find a better group of bakers and/or honest "mixer critics" than here on this site.  Good luck with your mixer evaluation.

HO

I own a KA Heavy duty, and am happy with it.  BUT to be honest, just for kneading there are much better machines out there.  It is not that I don't like it, but it is the multi function that this machine makes outstanding, making cookie dough with the flat beater or whipping cream is just a blast.  Making dough however works fine too, but when you make stiff doughs the speed might not be constant.  At least that is my experience.  Also last time when I made a batch of two loaves and some rolls, I did not exceed the maximum flour capacity but the motor started smelling like burned.   I stopped the KA and kneaded with my hands.I love my KA but if I needed a machine to only knead bread dough I would get something else.  Hope this helps.Bart ilovebreadblog

Sherri,

I have the 7 quart Viking and it is wonderful.  I had a KA 525W Mixer, and nearly killed it trying to knead ciabatta for 13 to 15 minutes at speed 8.  It was really screaming and making an awful noise.  Since I bake a few loaves every week for a local restaurant I really need a mixer.  I am most pleased with this new mixer.  It has heavy duty stainless dough hook and other attachments.  It does not even get warm with heavy kneading.  I got a new red one.  Very pretty.

I have a DeLonghi 5 quart, which I think is more or less the same machine as the Viking.  It handles stiff, whole grain doughs just fine.  Capacity wise, it makes 3 good sized pan loaves.  There are times I wished Ihad the 7 quart, just for the larger capacity, which is kind of silly in a 2 person household!

I can't comment on the Viking product but I can wave you off of the newer KA product(s).  Case in point:  After 13 months of once a week usage on a KitchenAid KP26M1XNP Professional 600 Series 6-Quart, never using more than 6 cups of flour and not kneading above 4 or 5.  The worm follower looked like this

The gears also gave out on my KitchenAid KP26M1XNP Professional 600 Series 6-Quart - also after about 13 months of use, once a week. The repair was expensive. Next time it gives out I think I'll go for the DLX. The apparently different kneading mechanism/motion may make the drive mechanism less susceptible to failure.

I'm new to this bread-making stuff, but I recently purchased a Bosch Compact Kitchen Machine off Ebay for under $100 and the thing is amazing.  It's the small 4 qt one, but there's a 700 watt one in the $250 range that would probably accomodate your needs.  The motor is extremely powerful and I use it mainly for whole wheat or rye doughs.  It's a lot simpler than KA--just 4 speeds.  But it's small and not so noisy and also has attachments for a blender and slicer.  Pretty unique piece of equipment.

I have been looking into purchasing a my first new mixer. I researched the Kitchen Aid and the Professional 600 Series. I like the that it does more then bread and can get all the great attachment, so I can do more then bread. They are still made in Ohio from what the website says. Plus it is still all metal gears. 

I have a five-quart Artisan KA that was a gift from my daughter.  For many years I dreamed of owning a KA and frequently would make the comment, "One of these days I'm going to have one of those"....well, now I do, and I am very thankful to my daughter for my gift, but I must share this secret:

 I'm very, very disappointed in the lack of product integrity.  The way the bowl attaches to the mixer, screwing into the base, was a shortcut to something else, but what?  I haven't a clue, but it certainly needs some rethinking.  Also, that bowl is less than stellar, for the cost of this machine one would expect something more heavy duty and at least precisioned. 

The motor....are all of them so noisy? 

The attachment mechanism, where one changes out the whisk to the dough hook, etc., who thought that up?  No matter how careful one is, there is ALWAYS a concern that flour, or any other fine dust can interfer with this mechanism.  I wipe it and the thread each time I use it, and I always find that I am removing debris along with a bit of black grease.  How, or when do I need a lube job on this prize? 

Okay, I said this was my two cents, I could add another forty-five (to a couple bucks worth), but I think it is quite obvious that I find this item OVERPRICED and UNDERPERFORMING.  (While visiting my daughter, I used her 'hand-me-down' from her MIL, that KA is at least 20 years old, the quality of that machine is far SUPERIOR to the one that I received as a gift.  No, I didn't have the heart nor the INTENTION of letting on that this older model is MUCH NICER than my new one.  I'm not heartless, clueless or meanspirited, but I will share my honest opinion with those of you considering this item). 

Please forgive my rant, remember my words as MY personal opinion.  Don't forward this on to my daughter and do yourselves a favor:  Weigh your decision by more than one opinion, but do inform yourselves going forward.  If I was offered all of Bill Gates money for my KA it would NOT be enough.  My KA is priceless by the mere fact that my loving daughter gave it to me.  I clean and shine it after each use and I am careful to follow the PRINTED instructions that came with it.  My greatest hope is that I can proudly admit, "My KA is still performing, is your's, honey?"

Having owned a K.A. that was made back when Hobart owned the company, some 20 years ago, I have had a good experience. But from everything I've heard and read about K.A. mixers, they are mostly living off their OLD name and reputation.  When I buy a new mixer it will be a Bosch or a DLX.  There are just far too many horror stories out there about the "new" Kitchen Aid machines.   Be careful with your selection, you're going to have to live with it a long time.  Good luck with your selection process. 

Howard - St. Augustine, FL

Hobart still makes the n50 as well as the n120 (12 quart) but for the price of a new 12 quart you can find a used 20 quart on ebay.  if you realy want a pro quality mixer get a real Hobart

if you are not going to mix very heavy doughs the pro unit "should" be ok for you NOTE the quotation marks)

I think I am going to go the same route and keep my small ultra plus KA for the other baking and get the DLX for bread. 

While I'm quite happy with my KA mixer, I'd love to see a DLX in action. Given the price is over $500, this is something I would never buy sight unseen. Are these carried by any stores? Or are they available only by mail?

Norm I looked all over for a video and couldn't find one before I bought my DLX. Thanks for that link. I've never been a big fan of multi function devices, thinking that they don't perform as well as a single device intended strictly for that purpose. In my opinion the DLX is a great machine for my bread making needs at home. I was a little sceptical that there was much difference in the way the hook or roller in the case of the DLX develops the gluten. That turns out to be totally wrong thinking. The dlx is much more effective at creating a dough that will windowpane and more quickly. That translates to better tasting and less oxygenated dough with a creamier dough color. I still have my old KA from the old days (20+ years) but I haven't used it since the DLX arrived.

Zolablue pointed me at the Pleasant Hill Grain Company as a source. They have a package available for just under $500 and were very prompt with shipment. Nice folks.
I think they also have most of the attachments.
http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/magic_mill_dlx_mixer.aspx

Eric

Hi, Mike. 

Thanks for sharing your experience. I have the Bosch Universal Plus, which is a new model. It has a more powerful motor. The bowl locks to the base rock solid, which I gather is an improvement, and the drive is now below the bowl.  As I've said, I have no personal experience with the DLX. 

So far, I've no complaints with the Bosch I have. I've used it only for bread. It certainly has handled heavy doughs (bagels) and higher volume (5-6 lbs of a fairly stiff dough) than my KA Accolade could without problems. I have not experienced the bowl flexing or creaking.

I don't think the wire whisks are recommended for creaming butter. They are, as you say, too fragile. They are designed for whipping egg whites and mixing thin batters. Bosch makes a heavier wire whisk and also a "cookie paddle" which seem more appropriate for creaming butter. 

FWIW, the vendor told me they get many fewer returns of Bosch machines than of the DLX machines they sell.   

David

...appear at times on eBay and generally sell for around $100 (plus shipping).

Since there is always a risk in purchasing used equipment, you should, if you're interested, make sure first that there is an authorized Kitchen Aid service center in your area, should it need repair or adjustment.

My Hobart-made Kitchen Aid 5 quart mixer - model K5A (purchased *used* from a small bakery about 30 years ago) did finally need service several years ago. It cost me $150 at the KA-authorized service center to have it done. The proprietor said if I didn't want to pay for the repair he would buy it - broken! - from me. He said he has a steady demand from local small bakeries and restaurants for these mixers. A testimony to how well Hobart used to make them.

To the OP, I bought the 1000 Watt Viking mixer that you are considering a few months ago.  I'm quite happy with it so far, have not done anything terribly challenging, but it handled 2 loaves of rye without complaining.  I too destroyed a Kitchenaid Professional 6-qt 450 watt, but that was due to the grain mill attachment.  On the Viking, I particularly like the way the bowl attaches to the base, and I like the design of the dough hook.  Unfortunately, I haven't had it long enough to attest to its durability.

Anecdotally, for those who have watched the Food Network over the past several years - if you notice, many of the shows used to have Kitchenaids on the sets, and now they mostly have Vikings.  Not sure if that means anything, but interesting to notice.

I've had my Bosch Universal Plus about a year and have no problems.  I generally make 3-4 loaves at a time or 10 pizza shells at a time.  I always thought I wanted a Kitchen Aid, but I'm glad I did my research before I bought.  I bought mine from Pleasant Hill Grain.  They were good to buy from and I will use them again.

Life is Good,

DaytonaDoug 

I have a KA 520-PRO (KV25G8XMC) "Chef's" special. After reading this thread, I got a screwdriver out and started poking into the insides. OK! All metal construction, gears and gear box. No plastic. Even has sintered bronze journals. No signs of ware and tear after many years of use. It's the right size for me (small 1/2 sized convection oven).

I have used Hobart floor stand mixers - both 3 and 4 speed, and have appreciated their quality. The KA has "12 cup flour power" (marketing speak, I presume). More importantly, it doesn't make wierd noises, and doesn't slow down under the loads I impose. I am very glad I checked the machines guts. I am much more comfortable (now) with it. Thanks, guys.

I've had a smaller Kitchen Aid and a Cuisinart mixer. I just blew out the Cuisinart after owning it for a year because I make a lot of stiff bread dough in it. My husband says we can buy one more mixer, but it better be the last one. I am really into making artisan breads and want this mixer to be "the one." I'm fine using my Kitchen Aid for cakes and cookies. If we can afford it, is it worth the investment in the Hobart N50? What allows them to command such a higher price for it vs. any of the other top-of-the-line countertop stand mixers?

What is an SP5, and who makes it?

I have been trying to make a fair comparison between the two; but, am really confused.  I will be using for bread making only.  Been using a Zojirushi X20 bread machine to knead my dough, 2 lbs at a time.  I have read the posts, but is there a place to compare the two side by side?

After nearly destroying my KA, I got a DLX from Pleasant Hill. It arrived today, I've already made my first batch of bread with it. I love it.

I haven't tried the DLX but I will swear by the Bosch Universal Plus. I had bought the Pro HD KA and within a week it started breaking. It isn't built for heavy duty bread making. The Bosch rocks. It is exactly what it portreys itself to be. I won't ever by another KA again unless it was 20+ years old and made by Hobart. They are right about the way they used to be made was better but anything made by whirlpool isn't worth the money they are asking. Bosch is a great machine and well made.  They have a great warranty and they make bread very well.   

While vainly looking for a  household sized spiral mixer that didn't have a fixed bowl and hook, I stumbled on the site of the Italian manufacturer of the SP5.  Evidently, all spiral mixers (at least from this company) have fixed bowls.  Now I'm back to either a Bosch or a DLX.

Anyway, since someone was looking for the website of the European Manufacturer, here it is.

http://www.avancinispa.it/default.asp?*p=85&fclassid=2%2C+3

I have lost track of the number of loaves of all kinds of bread from white to whole wheat and beyond that I've made with my 34-year-old Bosch mixer.  The only thing I've replace on it is the pin (once) at the top of the drive shaft and the ring portion of the lid assembly when I dropped it on a tile floor and chipped a big chunk out of the edge.  I've always made from four to five loaves of bread at once with it and it's heavy motor has handled it all.  I was warned away from the KA machines when I bought this machine in the 70's and I've never regretted it.  Unfortunately, Bosch has just changed the models but until I can no longer get parts for my old model, I will keep using it.  I have also used it for all kinds of cookies, cakes, anything baked you can think of--it does them all very, very well.