The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Forkish's Field Blend #2 - added yeast or no added yeast?

Anonymous baker's picture
Anonymous baker (not verified)

Forkish's Field Blend #2 - added yeast or no added yeast?

Forkish adds yeast on top of the leaven for his Field Blend #2. Is it really necessary to add the yeast or can I turn it into a straight sourdough? 

What's your experience? 

leslieruf's picture
leslieruf

up to you really. Might be a tiny bit lighter with the yeast added.  Its been a while since I have made it though.

Happy bakin' Abe

Leslie

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

Something about adding yeast to a sourdough seems wrong to me. If you've baked this loaf without and it turned out well then without it is! 

Levain build underway and hopefully a nice loaf tomorrow. 

starvingviolist's picture
starvingviolist

I expect that would change the loaf a lot. Those hybrid loaves in FWSY have a VERY high proportion of starter, and the added yeast helps balance this out. I would recommend you try the same flour blend as Field Blend, but use a lower amount of starter and a longer fermentation. Maybe start with the time and proportions suggested later in the book? Although I find his times are usually a bit too long.

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

Help balance out the starter to slow it down? Surely starter + yeast would speed things up? 

I'm about to mix the final dough in 30 minutes. The bulk ferment is about 5 hours with folds for the first 2. What I might do is keep the starter percentage and if I see the bulk ferment is faster I'll shape early. Once I see visible signs of bubbles just beneath the surface I'll end the bulk ferment. Sound good? 

starvingviolist's picture
starvingviolist

Yes, that's what I meant, the yeast speeds it up. My concern with the high amount of starter would be that the dough might acidify or otherwise start to break down too fast. Worth a try for sure, but if you end up with a very sour loaf, or if the dough starts to fall apart, try more like 200 g of starter, as Forkish suggests, and more like an 8-10 hour ferment. Upping the flour and water as necessary to get about 70-74% hydration. Good luck! Let me know how it turns out.

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

Just completed the final stretch and fold and after merely two hours I think the bulk ferment is done. The feel of the dough has changed, it's billowy and aerated. I can see its going to be a challenge to shape as it is. If I leave this five hours as in the recipe it'll all be over. So think I'll refrigerate for 30 minutes or so to make it more manageable and into the shaping and final proofing. Not going to claim victory just yet. 

Lazy Loafer's picture
Lazy Loafer

I usually make it with the tiny bit of added yeast, but all that changes is the timings, really. I've been finding lately that my bulk ferments are taking longer (or, I'm letting it go longer) and the dough is quite lovely. So try it without the added yeast, bulk ferment at cellar (cool but not in fridge) temperature overnight, then shape and bake in the morning. See how that goes.

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

Even sans yeast the bulk ferment seems to be done in just two hours and with the last stretch and fold. Going to refrigerate it now for about 30 minutes to make it easier to handle then onto shaping and final proofing. 

Lazy Loafer's picture
Lazy Loafer

Some yeasts reproduce in four hours or less, and some take more than 12 hours. I guess it depends entirely on what strains of yeast are predominant in your starter. Mine seems to be a bit sluggish lately. Of course, just when I get used to that it will all change and I'll be over-fermenting again! :)

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

I fed my starter and thought I had 4-6 hours before it would be half risen to be returned to the fridge. Went out for a couple of hours only to come back and find it peaked and tripled. Even when being fed after refrigerating for a week. My starter seems to have picked up some very fast strains of yeast. Not sure how I did it though :) 

Lazy Loafer's picture
Lazy Loafer

Wouldn't it be nice to know how that happened, so you could do it again (or not)! :)

HansB's picture
HansB

Both regularly use .2% IDY along with their natural starters. 

Abe, my bulk rise varies quite a bit even with the same starter, formula and workflow. Looking forward to seeing your loaf!

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

If I had added yeast in it would have been done before I started.

Perhaps the yeasts are enjoying the special red fife treat I've been giving them :)

Shaping is the most nerve wrecking part and this one is going to test me. I'll keep you posted. 

Danni3ll3's picture
Danni3ll3

out for most people. They worked for me because my kitchen is the same cool temperature as his but this is not the case generally. Trust your eyes and the dough. 

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

how much can the timings be off? Well lesson learned! 

Most important part of baking bread that took me a while to learn was to go by the look and feel of the dough. Still learning! 

leslieruf's picture
leslieruf

Did you get good volume in the BF?  I love this bread but always find shaping a bit challenging.  happy baking Abe

Leslie

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

...and just got it into the fridge. Refrigerating before shaping helped. It rose quite a bit in the fridge but the plastic bag was very wet. Now I'm afraid the dough will become too wet if the banneton goes straight into the plastic bag. I only noticed this when I put the banneton in the bag  and the outside became soggy. So i wrapped the banneton in a towel before placing inside a plastic bag. Sarah Owens recommends this for her doughs so I thought why not. 

Gotta say that I'm confident the bulk ferment went well as the dough smells really good. More so than previous bakes at this stage. I hope the rest goes well.

Now I need a drink :)

Thank you Leslie.

leslieruf's picture
leslieruf

are you baking tonight (your time) or are you doing overnight proof?  I have never had  a problem with excess moisture but sounds as if you have it sussed.  

and yeah, it is like Danni says watch the dough. its morning here and I will be baking today if all goes well and while its a recipe I know, I have increased grains/seeds so I must watch carefully too.

good luck with the bake.

Leslie

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

I'm going for an all night proof. New banneton too and will be baked free standing in the morning. Haven't had much luck with free standing loaves at this hydration before. Always ended up like a Ciabatta. That's why I took a long break from it but treated myself to a new banneton and thought what the heck. 

Best of luck with your bake and loving the sound of increased grains/seeds. 

Looking forward to results. Watch this space for a lovely ciabatta... I mean loaf!

Lazy Loafer's picture
Lazy Loafer

I know it's a bit late to weigh in on this thread, but when I proof shaped loaves in bannetons (or on my home made bread risers) in the fridge overnight, I cover the banneton and loaf with a cotton napkin first, then put the whole thing inside a plastic bag. The napkin absorbs the excess moisture and stays damp, but you don't get the condensation on the surface of the dough that way.

hanseata's picture
hanseata

I bake Forkish's loaves usually without added yeast.

But almost all the breads I sell are made with mixed leaven (and overnight bulk fermentation). The minimal additional yeast is just for a more reliable baking and delivery schedule. Otherwise there is no difference.

Karin

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

For this recipe is just fine. If the yeast is meant to boost the leaven then I can say it definitely doesn't need it. 

It out the oven and photo is now attached. Going out for the day now and will give an update later. 

leslieruf's picture
leslieruf

looks like you have a really active starter, well done.

Leslie

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

I have a few thoughts on the recipe and my process but will wait till I've seen the crumb and tasted it. 

This is half way between a Ciabatta and a loaf but that's down to not having a Dutch oven and improvising - not so well. 

Apart from that the bulk ferment and final proofing went well. The proof will be in the eating. 

HansB's picture
HansB

The bread looks great!

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

My make shift Dutch Oven wasn't a success and this bread suffered for it. It was a foil covered oven rack with an inverted silicone mould which didn't completely cover the dough. However what it lacks in height it more than makes up in flavour. Happy with it.

leslieruf's picture
leslieruf

I am working on getting more height by scoring differently. I love one centre slash and the resultant ear (normally) but find that several slashes more across the loaf than you would for a baguette is giving better height ie less spread.  I found as you have that a makeshift DO frequently doesn't give the desired result. I know it works for some folks but it didn't for me.

I reckon you made an awesome loaf!

Leslie

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

For this one I final proofed seam side down so the seam acts like the scoring. Forkish recommends this for a natural look. I also like doing it this way for high hydration loaves where I'm sure to mess the scoring up.

Tang really coming out in this loaf.

IceDemeter's picture
IceDemeter

I'm sure such an awesome little loaf is long gone by now, but I'm just getting a chance to catch up after a crazy week.

It's obviously a different hydration and shaping than you usually use, so there are a few more elongated holes in there, but still enough of those perfect-fermentation round holes to be yours!  While the cover may not have been ideal for steaming purposes, this one is definitely more "loaf" than "slipper", so I hope you'll be happy to end up using that new banneton quite often in the future.

Nice bake, and what a great conversation it generated --- so much to learn from.

Thanks and all best to you!  Laurie