Dough Splitting After Bulk?
Hi guys! I'm hoping for some help troubleshooting this odd issue I'm having where my dough kind of...splits apart after bulk. You can see some photos here: http://imgur.com/a/EbZgO. I didn't include the final loaf photos but it ended up being one of the worst I've ever baked — really flat and sour.
More details here, including my schedule and recipe:
11:10 PM: levain build with starter at about 75% activity
9:15 AM: autolyse with 650g 90° water; 180g levain; 748g AP flour; 49g rye; 110g wheat
10 AM: final mix (19g salt; additional 40g water. FDT 76-78°)
10:35 AM; 11:05 AM; 11:30 AM: three folds. dough felt really strong, probably due to relatively low hydration? bulk ferment was done in a warm oven (with light on).
3PM: ended bulk. dough seemed nice with plenty of activity until I turned it out onto the counter and noticed this weird...splitting. I didn't take a photo then but it looked much like it did upon pre-shape and final shape (linked above).
I've had this kind of splitting happen with young (2.5-3 hour levain) AND the overnight build, so I don't think it's that?
I feed my starter a mix of rye and AP flour and it seems really happy and behaves predictably. This is really frustrating because I've had some bakes where my dough is beautiful and shapes well (and produces a stellar loaf) and then I've started having these where my dough is just so...weird. And the bread turns out terribly and it's so discouraging! Any thoughts as to what may be causing this? I really can't trace what I'm doing differently. :/
Rye has little gluten and APF is not a high gluten flour. You might need more gluten and think about if you used a different grind or brand of rye for this loaf. Did you knead it differently so you may not have developed the gluten enough? More flour with gluten and less rye flour and more kneading. Did you over hydrate?
definitely didn't over-hydrate (this hydration was on the low end for me), and I mixed in the same way! the percentage of rye is so slim I doubt that's why...I wonder if it could be due to using AP rather than bread flour. I've read that bread flour can result in a gummy crumb sometimes so I wanted to try AP but maybe that was the wrong path to take. the dough did seem really strong, though. hmmm.
Bread flour next time
Almost 6 hours of bulk fermentation in oven with the light on is definitely too much. The definite sign for overfermented dough is the breakdown of gluten network and as result the dough is tearing. So nothing wrong with starter or flour, just the bulk fermentation was way too long in a relatively quite warm environment. So next time you have to shorten this and probably only 3 hours would be sufficient.
Happy baking kamki,
Joze
I think you may just be right about that — thanks!
You have code to 20% Levain
Bulk ferment starts when the Levain goes in! So when you autolyse with a Levain the fermenting starts.
5 hours 45 minutes bulk ferment.
20% levain at normal room temperature you're looking at around 4 hours ish give or take. If it's really warm where you are this will speed up.
You can autolyse without the Levain (which is the correct way) and drop the amount of Levain if it's really warm. Watch the dough and not the clock. When the dough looks aireated, billowy and there are signs of bubbles just beneath the surface it is done. No need to wait for it to double either.
I've seen autolyse both with and without — I want to say the Tartine methodology adds it in? But I may go back to not including it since I think you're right about overproofing, especially with how flat and sour it was!
If we're talking about mid 70s and higher then definitely you'll need to accommodate that.
I'm in the Pacific Northwest so it's not terribly warm and my house stays cool, but I think you're right and I've gotta shorten bulk. I think I'm also comparing too much to photos I've seen of others' bulk and chasing a level of activity that isn't realistic for me, like this and this whereas my successful bulk looks more like this.
Your bulk ferment looks fine. Comparing pictures won't always help. In yours I see a billowy dough with clear signs of bubbles beneath the surface. I'd be happy with that and move onto the shaping and final proofing.
What pictures don't always tell you is the hydration of the dough and flour used. A bulk ferment of one dough might not look exactly the same as another. Most importantly is if your dough looks and feels right.
A true autolyse is without the Levain even though some do still add it in. By all means add it in but if your dough is over fermenting then leave it out. Go for a cooler autolyse. It still is warm even if it isn't like the south west and room temperature water should be fine.
oh, yeah — that was a more successful bake a while ago! I (unfortunately) didn't take photos of this weekend's dough until I'd pre-shaped it. I'll definitely try autolysing without the levain this weekend and keep a closer eye on my bulk. Thanks for your help!
Looking forward!