The Fresh Loaf

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Questions about TangZhong method

HPoirot's picture
HPoirot

Questions about TangZhong method

So weekend i tried using this method for cinnamon rolls and i encountered a small hiccup with the TZ stage.

My TZ got very lumpy and wasn't quite the smooth silky custard as seen in the guides!

Also, can TZ be made with heavy cream or butter milk? Or must it be milk or water.

Norcalbaker's picture
Norcalbaker

are you using?  are you whisking until smooth before placing the pot on the burner?  Are you whisking constantly while heating?  Are you checking temperature to ensure you are not overheating?

i only use water, so I 

Doc.Dough's picture
Doc.Dough

TangZhong is a method that pre-gelatinizes a portion of the flour so it is about flour and water. I suppose that some fraction of the liquid can be fat, but I suspect that fat will interfere with the hydration of the flour. Just keep it simple and use flour and water then add the cream in the next stage of mixing.

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

Is one part flour to 5 parts water...  so if flour is 25 g  water will be 125g.    (Flour about 5% of total recipe flour.)

When using Einkorn, Spelt, Kamut flour or any whole ground or coarse flours I would suggest letting the solution sit for 15  to 30 minutes before heating so that the flour has fully hydrated and won't have a gritty mouth feel.

 I use the MicroWave stopping every 30 sec to stir.  Zapping on high until thickened.

I also weigh the bowl and solution before zapping and again after it is thickened adding back any water weight lost in cooking.

I don't see why one cannot use milk or buttermilk.  I would use water after thickening to restore weight lost in cooking.

HPoirot's picture
HPoirot

Oh silly me for forgetting to post my process.

First attempt was 182g milk to 30g flour - lump city. I was stirring all the times, but with a spatula, not a whisk, and i didn't check the temp.

Second attempt was slightly better, though still could see lumps. 150g milk to 30g flour, mixed the flour into the milk till combined, then zap in the microwave (20s bursts) till it looks like a 'custard'.

I'm a little surprised to read that we should add water back to the recipe to account for water loss, cos my recipe ended up being too wet and i had to add more flour. Though the idea sounds totally logical.

 

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

Take 5% from the flour and 5x its weight from the water.

So if your recipe is...

 

500g flour

300g water

10g salt

5g yeast

 

You'd take 25g from the flour and 125g from the water. Stir together on a low heat till it begins to gel. Should only take a few minutes and keep stirring. Take off the heat and let cool. Then rearrange your recipe like this...

 

475g flour (500g - 25g for the tangzhong)

175g water (300g - 125g for the tangzhong)

10g salt

5g yeast

+ tangzhong

 

koolmom's picture
koolmom

I have been making Cinnamon Rolls that use a Poolish as part of the leavening and it incorporates all the liquid. I have just discovered the Tangzhong method and think it would lighten up the dough in the cinnamon rolls. The Poolish has a pinch of yeast, 350 grams bread flour and 14 ounces of water--that is 414 grams of water. If I made it with a Poolish made of 332 grams flour and 324 grams of water (18 grams of flour and 90 grams of water for the Tangzhong), then let the Poolish sit overnight or 8-12 hours and become a pre-ferment and then added the Tangzhong slurry, before I added it to the rest of the flour, eggs, etc. Does anyone think that would work?

Or do I have to take into consideration all the flour used in the entire recipe which is 830 grams? That would require 42 grams of flour and 210 grams of water which would not leave a very large preferment

Doc.Dough's picture
Doc.Dough

At the moment I see no reason why you could not actually use some or all of your Tangzhong roux (after it has cooled) to make the poolish.  I don't think the yeast cares about how you pre-treated the flour to free up the sugars it wants to feed on.  So the experiment I would try:

Make a Tangzhong with 42g of flour and 210g of water, let it cool, add the rest of the 414g of water (204g) and the rest of the 350g of flour (308g), plus the pinch of yeast, whip it up and let it sit overnight.

And definitely report back with your results.