The Fresh Loaf

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Cheating in score, does this tells you what I'm doing wrong?

_vk's picture
_vk

Cheating in score, does this tells you what I'm doing wrong?

Hello all.

I've being cheating. Yeah. I confess... 

I'm baking covered loafs (combo cooker and other contraptions). More often than not, when I uncover the bread the scored part is already consolidated, showing that there will be no ears. But the loaf is not already fully risen yet. So some times I re-score the hot loaf, and it produces a little ear. You can see that in the following picture. To the right of the score there is the first score result. The opened one is the second score.

 

So In my last batch I did so in a boule that had been scored perpendicular (not after ears). I re scored perpendicular after first minutes covered in the oven. What I noticed is that the side that I re-scored deeper (left in the title picture) just rose more!! So besides some aesthetic effects, my regular scoring may be holding my loafs back!? Is that so?

(see title pic)

Ok so now I'm going to put the last batch (all same dough) in the oven. Two battards, as a test I scored one very shallow and the other very deep. Both in a shallow angle.

After the first 15 minutes covered:

-what I saw in the loaf very shallow scored there was no score at all, the loaf had rose well and but not bursted yet, so I gone and scored it. The loaf below is what I got. Very nice oven spring, and a cool ear:

-The loaf that have being scored deep at first has already a little ear. I think I left it untouched. The result is below. Perhaps a little less rose than the other.

 

So my questions is: 

Can you see what I'm doing wrong that prevents my regular score to work? Score? Steam? What!?

 

 

:)

The dough is:

60% WW 40%BF

~78% hydration

a little flax added.

13% levain

most fridge fermented.

 

A crumb shot (the very end of the loaf)

 

 

jimbtv's picture
jimbtv

Selection of flours, hydration levels, the strength of your levain, steam, timing and temperature will all affect the oven spring. From what I have learned from others here, 60% whole wheat flour generally won't produce the oven spring of a smaller percentage. With that said I think the loaves look wonderful and I am envious of the crumb you have produced.

I wouldn't conclude you are "cheating" but instead have found a means to adapt to the situation. The end result is impressive. To create the same result without the second score I think you will have to modify the mix and proofing methods and that can take time and practice. But lots of practice means lots of great tasting bread around and there is nothing wrong with that!

I don't work much with whole wheat but others here use it extensively, so I am sure some more specific advice is forthcoming.

 

Jim

markgo's picture
markgo

WW bread won't look as pretty as BF bread. For a 60/40 WW bread, yours look exceptional! 

Maybe go for a 50/50 blend and see how that works? Peep at this site for inspiration, maybe.  

I'm sure it tastes pretty good tho! 

When my wife and kids eat my sourdough bread, the wife wants a piece with the most crust, my youngest wants  the "butt" end,  and my other kid wants the crumb with as little crust as possible -- they don't even care about the ears, as long as it tastes good! Haha. :D

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

that is over proofed but not so much that it collapses.  The hardest part of baking bread by far is knowing when it is perfectly ready for the heat of the oven.  It took me the longest time to realize that I was over proofing every loaf and got what you do,  Just cut back the proof and all will be well. 

kendalm's picture
kendalm

Yesterday I overproofed and had very flat loaves. Gotta figure out the final proof timing to perfection. When done right it should explode upwards !

Lazy Loafer's picture
Lazy Loafer

Those are absolutely gorgeous and I wouldn't change a thing (especially if they taste good!).

leslieruf's picture
leslieruf

and look pretty good to me too.  I figure do what works for you!

Leslie

PatMax's picture
PatMax

There is nothing wrong with those loaves  

_vk's picture
_vk

Guys, thanks very much for all kind and enlighten answers.

And also thanks for the compliments. I do think those loafs are great, and they taste good, and they are brainless and I'm so proud of them. Thanks. Wish I could share it with you guys. There is something in bread making that is only complete when other people are eating the bread you made...

Anyway, the thing is that I thought that this very specific behaviour could hint some more experienced baker here to show me where I can improve my skills. And besides the aesthetic "ear" I'm wondering if this is holding some of my loafs rise.

 

I liked Dab's tip on over proofing. I think I am an over proofer...

So I'll try less proofing next time. Thanks.

Also I liked the "whatever works for you" and "adapt to the situation" way of thinking. 

Indeed if is working, it's not wrong, right?

Perhaps I'll also try to improve this weird "late scoring technique".

Thank you all.

 

Happy Baking.

 

vicente

PatMax's picture
PatMax

.

_vk's picture
_vk

cheers.

 

dmsnyder's picture
dmsnyder

First, the main purpose of scoring is to direct the expansion of the loaf during oven spring. To score after most of the spring has occurred may produce a more pleasing appearance, but I wouldn't accept that as an ultimate solution.

Second, I agree with dbm that over-proofing could be a factor. Do you know about "the poke test?"

Third, from looking at your photos, I suspect that scoring technique is a major factor. Specifically, I suspect you could improve the angle of your cuts and their depth. I recommend reviewing the scoring tutorial. Many TFL members have found it useful. You can find it here: Scoring Bread: An updated tutorial

Happy baking!

David

_vk's picture
_vk

I will look again at the tutorial, and try to work on my scoring technique, indeed I read it when I was just beginning, some time ago now...

"I wouldn't accept that as an ultimate solution."

 that was my thought also...

Thanks for your tips. 

H.B.

V.

alfanso's picture
alfanso

May I provide one further suggestion for scoring batards.  They will take on a better bloom, in general, if you start from one end of the batard and score down to the other end.  And not just somewhat from one end to the other, but truly from tip to toe.  

I notice that your scores are not sufficiently drawn all the way across the full length of the dough.  I believe that this will constrict the bloom by not allowing the entire length of the batard to expand.

There are a lot of examples on TFL that demonstrate this to be so.  Look around...

alan

_vk's picture
_vk

I never thought that could be an issue. Good to now. Next time I'll try a longer cut.

Thanks Alfanso.

H.B.

V.