A lesson - retarding bulk ferment vs shaped proof
Well, I nearly ruined a large bake (eleven loaves) of my best deli-style rye bread today, simply by following the recipe instead of my own smarts. I've baked this bread many times (I've got two customers who absolutely love it and order large batches fairly regularly).
The recipe is originally from Peter Reinhart's "Crust and Crumb". It takes a long time as there are three stages of starter, each one of which can be refrigerated overnight, so it takes some planning. The recipe recommends a shortish bulk ferment at room temperature, then shape and proof (three hours at room temperature, then overnight in the fridge, then an hour at room temperature before baking). I should listen to my own advice - based on my factors (room temp, flour, whatever) it never ends well when I do that.
Last time I made this bread it was lovely. That's because I bulk fermented overnight in the fridge, then shaped cold, proofed at room temp for a couple of hours and baked. The dough was a dream to handle and the finished loaves were beautiful
Yesterday / today I followed the recipe and did the room temperature bulk ferment, then shaped and proofed (2.5 hours at room temp, overnight in the fridge, then baked cold). The loaves were very overproofed and totally collapsed on the peels (I mean totally). There was a little bit of oven spring anyway and I'm hoping the customer is okay with skinny slices! Should still taste good, but here are the photos of today for comparison:
No more shaped overnight retarding for me! I'll stick with what works in my kitchen.
Comments
and adjust the procedure to your schedule and needs. The difference in your two bread batches speaks for itself!
When I started baking for sale, I didn't see how I could get the breads ready in time without risking a divorce (my husband, nevertheless, complains regularly that I leave him alone in the "baker's bedroom"!)
The breads were from Peter Reinhart's "Whole Grain Breads", and I just tried it, bulk fermenting the doughs overnight in the fridge, starting with the pre-doughs in the morning, mixing the dough in the evening, and shaping and baking the breads the next day. (I can reduce the yeast amount almost by half).
Works like a charm, I deliver the breads in time - and my marriage is safe!
Happy Baking,
Karin
proof in the fridge while you sleep. I can go 21 hours in the winter but only 9-12 in the summer - If I don't do a bench proof before going in the fridge! If you bulk fermented in the fridge for the same tome and then shaped and proofed the next morning you have more time proofing at a higher temperature at the end. All you had to do is reshape the loaves and let them proof again - just like you would if it was bulk fermented, shaped and proofed the next morning. That is what I do when it over proofs in the fridge and shaped - just do it again.
The tome fermenting is the same either way but nothing beats a shaped proof in the fridge crumb and crust wise if it doesn't over-proof while you sleep - it is just much riskier.
Happu baking
It just never seems to work for me, even if I only leave it in the fridge for 8 to 10 hours then bake it almost straight out of the fridge the next day. It also doesn't seem to matter which fridge it is (I have two that I can use for fermenting / proofing bread) so I don't think it's the temperature. There have only been one or two recipes where the overnight proof has worked for me. :(
I'd be okay risking it if it was only a loaf or two for me, but eleven loaves for a special order for special customers, that's something different! Also, re-shaping one loaf isn't too much trouble, but shaping a large batch is a lot of wasted effort. :)
How's the temperature down your way now? It must be waaaaay too hot for baking bread.
106-108 F for monsoon season. We just had a dust storm so hopefully rain will be on the way right after. The monsoon was late and weak as they go and the heat oppressive. I remember the year where monsoon never came and we had 150 days in a row over 100 F. This one is just as bad. I'm pretty sure I can bake a loaf of bread in 3 hours from start to oven once the levain hits the mix. I should give that a try.........
I'm guessing that Mark Sinclair can shape 11 loaves in less than 3 minutes while shaping a dozen rolls in the other hand :-) Someday......
So, the weather has turned cool-ish then? :) We actually saw your dust storm here on our local weather report (we're on, or rather off the West Coast of Canada, on Vancouver Island). Looked truly nasty. Is it humid now to go along with the heat? Yes, I think bread dough would proof before your very eyes, and you'd have to be quick with the oven pre-heat to bake it in time!
It always amazes me when I watch some of those shaping videos, particularly in bakeries like Tartine where the staff look like they're day dreaming about all kinds of other things while they effortlessly shape vast amount of very soft, wet dough into perfect loaves, without any sticking or fuss. I don't think that skill is anywhere in my future...
It was black. In the summer I could set it out side in the sun and it would hit a perfect 225 F temperature inside with no fire at all. Easiest ribs ever:-) No tending the fire - just drinking beer and waiting 5 hours:-) The aran word for dust storm is haboob. The nitwits here discovered the word a couple of years ago and now every dust storm we have is a haboob. I have lived here for 30 years and seen lots of dust storms and not one of them lasted more than 2 hours.
I also lived in Saudi Arabia was in just 1 haboob. It lasted 3 days and stripped the paint off my car - that is a haboob. We has a tiny dust storms here that look nasty on video but it isn't at all a haboob. A real haboob will just kill you in less than 24 hours and then strip the meat off your bones the next 48 hours. Here you just stay inside for 2 hours and then spend 2 hours cleaning the pool:-)
Monsoon can be really strange here. It can be 110 F by noon cloud up and then rain by 1 PM. By 2 PM the sun can come out again and it will get back to 110 F with 100% humidity by 4 PM - now that is brutal but it doesn't happen all that often either.
Maybe you could bake bread in a solar oven? Or maybe on the dash in your car. :)
The DH built me a solar dehydrator a couple of years ago. Works pretty good! Love those sun-dried tomatoes...
Thanks for your words of support and encouragement; it's so nice to know that method works well for you too! I've got an extra fridge in the workshop and it's usually full of buckets and bowls overnight before shop day. It takes a bit of work on baking morning to shape them all, but it's better than having a flop.
Just an update on the flop - both customers have sent me notes this afternoon telling me how delicious the bread is, so that's a relief at least!
that their flops taste great! Less Spring - More Taste...Less Spring - More Taste it's not just for Lite Beer:-)
No question you have to play against your environment. I have been proofing in the Brod & Taylor proofing box to jump start the shaped loaf before the cold ferment, and I was surprised recently when one of the two loaves overproofed. That was a good lesson for me to watch carefully for proofing levels. Overall, I've had great results (for my experience level) with shaping, with some warm proofing if needed, followed by cold retard. Yesterday I baked a couple Hamelman WW multigrain loaves after more than 24 hours. I had pushed the fermentation to 82 and raised the hydration. The shaped loaves seemed plenty proofed, so I skipped it, and baked straight from the fridge the next day and got great oven spring.
Incidentally, those flat loaves still look mighty tasty.
Me too. A cold overnight proof only succeeded once. An overnight bulk ferment and shaping the next day is the best way to go!