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Thoughts on combining Tartine, bran levain and Artisan in 5?

Danni3ll3's picture
Danni3ll3

Thoughts on combining Tartine, bran levain and Artisan in 5?

I am going to attempt this for fun and to see if I can get those nice big holes which I am going to get one way or another with a whole grain bread. I can do it with recipes who have a high percentage of AP flour but the crumb tightens right up when I go for lots of whole grain flour. I am hoping I will have better luck with this one. If anyone sees any glaring errors in my method or you have thoughts on this, please let me know. Thanks in advance.

The recipe is Wheat-Rye 20% Boule from Tartine 3. Levain method is per DaBrownMan and method is mostly from Artisan Breads in 5 minutes and their website plus a few Forkish folds thrown in for good measure.

1. Sift whole-wheat flour and rye flour to extract the larger pieces of bran. I obtained 25 g of bran for the levain.  Recipe has 287 g high extraction flour (reduced 113 grams from recipe because of the increased amount of levain- see below), 200 g dark rye flour and 100 g whole wheat flour as well as 300 grams of all purpose flour.

 2. Use bran and high extraction flour (locally milled partially sifted flour) to make 3 builds of levain, each 4 hours apart. Build one: 25 g levain/25 g bran/25 g water. Build two: all of levain/50 g flour/50 g water. Build three: all of levain/100 g flour/100 g water. Total 375 grams of levain as per Artisan in 5 (They suggest 1.5 cups of sourdough starter which is ~375 g in weight.) (Tartine’s original recipe called for 150 g levain so I removed 113 g each of flour and water from the main recipe). Let rise 25% after last feeding and put into fridge for about 24 - 36 hours.

3. Pull the levain out of the fridge and let it rest at room temp for 2 hours until it rises about 25%. May need to put in oven with door cracked open as my room temperature is 70-72F.

4. Meanwhile, autolyse 287 g of high extraction flour, 300 grams all purpose,  200 g sifted rye and 100 g sifted whole wheat as well as 70 wheat germ. Mix with 687 g (reduced 113 g because of increased levain) of 90 to 100F water. Let autolyse for 2 hours at 70-72F.

 5. Add all of the bran/flour levain, ½ tsp yeast, 25 g salt and 50 grams of water. Pinch and fold until fully integrated and the dough develops some structure.

6. Do 3 sets of stretch and folds in the bucket 20 minutes apart for the first hour. Let sit until it rises almost to the top of the bucket and starts to flatten out. This could be another hour or up to 12 (as per Artisan in 5 website when you change or reduce the yeast). Time only will tell. Put into fridge until ready to bake, minimum overnight. Dough should keep at least a week, probably 2.

7. When ready to bake, take dough out of fridge. Divide the dough, pre-shape, let rest 20-30 minutes and then shape it into boules and let sit for 60-90 minutes in proofing baskets that are dusted with brown rice and AP flour.

8. Pre-heat oven to 500F for 45 minutes. Put loaves into hot Dutch ovens. Twenty minutes later, lower temp to 450F. Remove lids at the half hour mark, and then bake uncovered for 20 to 30 minutes.

 

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

you can get but expecting them to be like ciabatta is not realistic.  But it will taste 10 time better than ciabatta too.  Can't wait to see the results.  Don't use minutes to final proof.  Proof it to 85% increase in volume and get it in the oven regardless of time.  Watch the dough not the clock.  Whole grain breads ferment and proof fast especially with that much rye it.

A very open crumb for this kind of bread may surprise you when you see it:-) Good luck!

Danni3ll3's picture
Danni3ll3

are done! I am quite surprised at how quickly the levain got to 25% after the last feeding. It was just over an hour. It is now sitting in the fridge. 

I may have to leave it there for longer than 36, closer to 43 due to other commitments. We will see. 

Danni3ll3's picture
Danni3ll3

Well, I didn't get the huge holes I wanted but the bread tastes awesome with a nice little tang. The crumb is custardy and the crust is super nice but then again, how can you go wrong when baking it in a dutch oven. 

I did some more reading on the Artisan in 5 website and it suggested to add VWG to help with the rise of wholewheat breads. I did add two tablespoons but I really don't see any difference from my other wholewheat breads.

A few things of note:

The levain never did rise to 25% even after 3 hours. 2 of those hours were at 70F and one at ~82F. It was full of bubbles so I used it after 3 hours.

The flour mix ended up autolysing for 3 hours due to the levain not doing its thing properly.

I mixed the levain, flours, extra water, and yeast together and let sit for a half hour. Then I added the salt and proceeded as above.

It took 5 hours to rise and start collapsing so that part is good to know when using 350 g of sourdough at 70F room temp.

The dough sat in the fridge for 12 hours only because we ran out of bread and I needed to bake. I had planned to keep it in there for longer but that didn't happen.

I watched the dough and let it proof for 90 minutes. I am still having trouble judging when it is ready for the oven and tend to err on the side of under proofing. I am wondering if I really should let it proof longer. Can anyone tell from looking at the loaf?

 

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

oven before it over proofed.  DO you have pictures of when it went into the basket and then again right before it came out of he basket?  That is the only way we can tell how much it has proofed.  You do want tot be on the side of under proofed for sure.  This one is pretty nice .  How much whole grains are in this  bread?  Looks like a 50% WG brea

Well done and happy baking

Danni3ll3's picture
Danni3ll3

Thank you for your kind comments and your help with all of this. Here are the picts you asked for:

In basket at the beginning of proofing: 

At the end of proofing:

Both pictures are taken with the proofing baskets in a plastic bag so that is why the picture isn't super clear. There wasn't a lot of rise between the two but I kept your comments in mind about over proofing  so I may have baked it a bit too soon.

As to the grains including the levain, I had 47% high extraction flour (locally milled flour with 20-25% of bran sifted out 11.something% protein), 30% unbleached all purpose flour (13.3% protein), 20% dark rye flour and 10% wholegrain wholewheat flour (13.3% protein) and 7% wheat germ. So it has a fair bit of whole grain in it.

Danni

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

on.  Now you know! No wonder the bread came out so well!

Ru007's picture
Ru007

with an open crumb is my dream loaf!

I'm still learning the basics of sourdough so I've only gone up to about 20% ww flour.

Your loaves look fantastic though! Looking forward to seeing your next bake.