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Danish Rye loaf tastes like it should, but too crumbly to slice

Nominingi's picture
Nominingi

Danish Rye loaf tastes like it should, but too crumbly to slice

Why does 100% rye bread get so crumbly that one can't slice it I wonder.

This is the formula I use at present; I use all rye instead of substituting with 100-200g of strong white flour. Should I try that? My preference would be to figure out how to stop the 100% rye loaf from being so crumbly

Thank you!

In a large bowl mix together: • c. 200 g sourdough starter • 500g rye meal • 100 g whole rye grains • 150 g cut rye grains ("kibbled rye") (Isabel: kibbled rye is also known as cracked rye. Crack rye berries aka grains in coffee mill or substitute with whole rye grains) • 750 cc water (ca. 37°). • 1 tsp. salt Leave covered (if possible at 20 -25°) for at least 12 hours. The mixture should then be about 50% larger, spongy and have a delicious sour smell. Take out c. 200 g of the mixture to use as starter for the next batch. Keep in a loose-fitting (CO2 produced!) container in the fridge till the next baking session (within 10 days).

Add: • 150 g cut rye grains • 350 g rye meal • 2 tsp. salt • 200 cc water.

Alternative dough: if you are not baking for someone with wheat allergy, then you can make the rye bread less likely to be crumbly by substituting 100 or 200g say of strong white flour for some of the rye. Stir well. The dough should be about the stiffness of freshly mixed concrete. It should not be easy to stir. Adjust with water or rye meal. Line your baking tin(s) with baking parchment. Press the dough down into the tin (otherwise there may be holes in the bread). Fill no higher than 3 cm from the top. Use a fork to prick the dough. Original baking method: I usually spray the surface of the dough with water to stop it drying out. Let the dough rise (c.4-5 hours) until the dough has risen about 2 cm. If it rises much more it will collapse during baking. Rising time varies, sometimes 2 hours sometimes 6-8. Cover the tins loosely with aluminium foil and bake for 20 min in a 250° oven at then turn the temperature down to 180° and bake for further 1.5 hours. Take the bread out and remove from the forms, place on a rack. Remove the baking paper cautiously. The bread easily gets damaged when still hot. When the bread is still slightly warm, wrap it in a dish-towel/kitchen cloth and put it in a plastic bag. Keeping in some moisture helps to soften the crust which otherwise can be hard to carve. Wait till the next day before cutting the bread. Alternative baking method: I now do the second rising in a turned-off oven, with a kettle of boiling water in a pan in the bottom. This provides an ideal rising environment - warm and moist with no problems of the top drying out. The dough only takes an hour to rise, and then I just switch the oven on to 160°C and bake it for 3 hours. You can leave the bread to cool in the switched off oven. It is hard to overcook it! So you can do the whole process from starting the second rising in absentia using the oven timer. This method produces a darker more caramellised loaf. I expect you could cook it even longer (perhaps at a an even lower temperature) for an even darker loaf.

 

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

But where is rye flour, the finer bits?  I see whole, kibbled, chops, meal ...but is there any rye flour,  finer flour in the dough?  This might explain the "crumbles."   

Nominingi's picture
Nominingi

Hello Mini, in my part of the world (British Columbia Interior) one can buy Dark Rye flour in supermarkets or Rye flour from a mill. The latter is probably equivalent to the Dark Rye in that the entire rye grain is miled into a fine flour. I don't really know what rye meal would be called here and have only ever used the Rye flour I get from a mill on the lower mainland.

What puzzles me is that my formula will produce a fine loaf one time, one that I can slice thinly as it should be and the very next time I bake the same formula, I have such a crumbly loaf that I cannot slice it thick or thin

Any answers for me?

 

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

baking with Roger's Rye.  I suspect the starter is the first place to start.  Because the rise times are so long, have you got any up close full slice crumb shots?  I don't know what I think about it yet, need more info.  Try cutting with a sharp straight knife.

Usually when the dough and loaf are unpredictable, the yeast in the starter is to blame, too much or too little. 

Starter:  Off hand, it looks like the chilled starter gets one feeding, then take out 200g starter (for the next batch and not giving it any more food while it's chilled for another 10 days.  This could be the problem--weak yeast numbers.  

Symptoms:  When that 12 hr ferment is over and you add more flour, the dough is fermenting too long.  

By the time the yeast gets going in the dough, the dough enzymes have already broken the matrix down.  That's what it looks like to me.

Mini

Nominingi's picture
Nominingi

Nominingi's picture
Nominingi

Hi Mini I have a 100% hydration 90:10 AP:rye starter which I activate and then use for the formula. I suspect my dough was too moist hence the crumble.

 

 

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

but it tastes so good that way!