The Fresh Loaf

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Did BROTKUNST ever post TL Country French w/clear flour

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weavershouse's picture
weavershouse

Did BROTKUNST ever post TL Country French w/clear flour

I'd like to try making the Thom Leonard Country French bread again and I remember brotkunst posted using clear flour. Was there ever a full recipe posted or has anyone else tried using the clear flour in this recipe? If so, what part of the flour in the recipe was replaced.

I made this recipe according to the book but found the sifting of whole wheat flour tedious. It was delicious but I'm wondering if I would like the clear flour better. Any suggestions? Anyone make this lately with clear flour? Thanks.                                
weavershouse

bwraith's picture
bwraith

Weavershouse,

I love the Golden Buffalo flour from Heartland Mills when you need a high extraction red wheat flour. I did two TL CF recipes recently, both using the Golden Buffalo, and they seemed to come out very well. The first was using all GB flour to replace all the flour in the recipe (other than the touch of whole rye), including the levain flours (used a white flour starter, though). It worked beautifully, except I probably got it slightly too wet, and then had a "lazy baker" hole on one side (see photos). That was my fault, though.

I posted some photos of that one, and another one that was almost exactly the same, except I used 100g spelt and put the rye in the levain (rest of levain flour was GB), which also worked very well, maybe better in that I love the flavor of the spelt /rye levain in this bread.

Bill

weavershouse's picture
weavershouse

I just placed an order for the Golden Buffalo. I've been wanting to try it for some time, you've always given it good reviews. While at the Heartland site I ordered rye berries (ever try them?) and looked at the rye flakes but I would have to purchase 25 or 50Lbs! 
Meanwhile I'm going to try the spelt version. It seems the members here have tried many variations and are happy with most. My first try was a few days ago and when I took it out of the oven I wondered why I took so long. I guess reading the "high-extraction" thing. I made two small and one large loaf. A lot of delicious bread.

Thanks for your help and suggestions.  
p.s. Did you bake the TL CF in your outdoor oven? I didn't see a post about these, just photos.                                                 weavershouse

bwraith's picture
bwraith

Yes, I did both of those in the new brick oven. It is also the first time I had done the TL-CF, after some prodding by ZB, who is a big fan of this recipe and felt it is one of those signature recipes one can learn a lot from. I did like this recipe. I guess my favorite miche recipe, which I'm still in search of, will have a little more whole wheat and a spelt starter. However, the ideal consistency is elusive, and it depends a lot on the flours. That brings up one point, which is that the Golden Buffalo seems to need more water to be at the same consistency as other flours I've used. It acts more like a whole wheat flour in terms of absorption. Even 80% hydration might be a soft but not too wet dough with the GB flour. On the first one, I used about 85% hydration, and it was a little too much, so I had problems with those holes you see in the crumb. On the second I used about 79.5%, which worked much better.

ehanner's picture
ehanner

weavershouse etal,

I make this and swap 10% clear for some of the AP and I also add 50 grams of light Rye in the poolish. The Rye really helps the flavor and the clear helps with strength so I can free form the loaves and bake them without having to re-tighten them midway through the proof. I guess that would be a matter of hydration and development but I find it helps.

Hope that helps.

Eric

weavershouse's picture
weavershouse

I'll give the Country French a try with your formula. I bought some clear flour from KA and want to finally use some of it. Yesterday I made the CF with spelt instead of the high extraction flour. I didn't let it rise enough I guess because it busted out all over. Still tasted v. good but not too pretty. They didn't have the deep dark color I got with the sifted High-extraction flour.
Thanks again.                                                                                                                                          weavershouse

ehanner's picture
ehanner

Weavershouse, that Golden Buffalo is really interesting flour. I bought some a while back on the recommendation of some one here. (Can't recall who at the moment) If only for the range of colors you will love the breads from G-Buffalo.

Eric

bwraith's picture
bwraith

Weavershouse,

I was reading what I wrote below, and it occurred to me I may not have been clear about what I did with the spelt in the variation I mentioned previously. I was suggesting to use something 100g of spelt plus the rye plus enough Golden Buffalo flour to compose the flour in the levain. Then use Golden Buffalo for all the remaining flour in the recipe, noting that the water will need to be adjusted so that the overall hydration is closer to 79% (all water in recipe as a percent of all flour in recipe), due to the large amount of water the Golden Buffalo flour will absorb.

It's interesting to hear you tried spelt for the entire recipe and that it seemed to ferment more slowly than you expected. I haven't watched that closely when I've used spelt in my levains - never tried 100% spelt in sourdough final dough. The levains with spelt in them seemed to ripen uneventfully, but I was doing it overnight and didn't check the timing all that carefully.

Bill

weavershouse's picture
weavershouse

TLCFThom Leonard Country FrenchThom Leonard Country FrenchTLCF                                                                                           Here is my thom Leonard Country French made using Spelt instead of the 350gr high-hydration flour called for in the final dough. As you can see they busted out all over in the oven spring even after making deep slashes. I guess I didn't let them proof long enough. I went by how they looked and never poked them to check for sure. Sorry my photo doesn't show the crumb better but it was late and dark outside so I had to take the picture indoors and I just can't get a good clear shot without natural light. 

 

 

These tasted very good and make great toast. I look forward to trying the Golden Buffalo and a little clear flour.

Bill, thanks for the clarification. I'll give it a try next time. 

weavershouse

zolablue's picture
zolablue

Weavershouse, I just wanted to mention my experiences again using first clear flour.  I just don't see the need for the stuff at all.  If you read my initial thread on it, and I hate to admit this again, I completely misunderstood what the flour was and then once I received it I had no idea what to do with it.  It was quite a shock, too, when it turned into a big rubber band.  Ugh.

 

I have tried making TL with the first clear exactly as Brotkunst gave instructions for on that other thread.  It just isn't all that good, in my opinion, especially compared to the other myriad flours that can be used in the recipe.  Golden Buffalo is outstanding and well worth buying.  I think I'll always have it on hand after baking TL with it only once so far.  It was fun to compare the flavor and texture of TL made with the GB compared to the times I tried to simulate high-extraction flour by sifting.  In those cases I had started using the Hodgson Mill WW graham flour (sifted) I like so well because of the special sweetness it imparts that I just cannot seem to get from regular WW flour.  The times I sifted organic or traditional KA WW flour it didn't taste quite as good to me. 

 

Anyway, that is my two cents on the first clear.  I would stay clear of it.  (Hehe - sorry, could not resist.)

weavershouse's picture
weavershouse

I hope it is anyway. I think the recipe is a little tricky to understand on first reading. I can be a skimmer sometimes and i just assumed the final dough took 350 grams whole wheat till I luckily turned the page and read that she's calling for 250 grams (after sifting). So I take it I'll have to sift the GB to get the 250 grams? That is right, isn't it. That's what I did the first time I made this recipe when I used Hodgson WW which I did like very much. 

As far as the clear flour goes maybe I'll save it for bagels or rye bread. Have you ever done this?    
Thanks for your suggestions.                                              weavershouse

zolablue's picture
zolablue

I agree, that recipe can be confusing especially if you skim AND don't turn that page. :o)

 

The deal is that Golden Buffalo is already the perfect high-extraction flour which means no sifting is required.  If you read (ahem...lol) the intro to the recipe, Glezer will tell you that if you use high-extraction flour you simply substitute it entirely for the whole-wheat and bread flour.  That means you will use 1000g of Golden Buffalo in the final dough recipe.  No need to sift. 

 

I wasn't exactly clear if she wants us to also substitute GB for the bread flour in the levain and darn if I can remember what I did for sure.  I know Bill did use GB in his and I think I would be tempted.  Honestly, I do think I did as well.

 

Bill also posted about the first clear being really good for bagels and I think someone else did.  It is supposed to be good in rye breads. 

 

Don't necessarily take my word for this on my dislike of first clear, Weavershouse, as you might have a different opinion.  Just know that if you do try a large amount of first clear in this type of recipe please make sure you are nearby your computer for when you start to scream and need immediate love and support from TFL forum friends.  (wink)

weavershouse's picture
weavershouse

Heartland Mills just called and said there was a computer error on my order and the shipping for 10lbs. of BF would be about $21.00 Yikes! I decided to cancel the order. I'll stick with the Hodgsons that I can get at my local store.
After going back to read about the GB I guess I wouldn't have to sift it. It doesn't matter now anyway since I won't be getting any.                                               weavershouse

zolablue's picture
zolablue

Yeah, Weavershouse, they do have kind of high shipping and handling.  Darn, well, maybe another time you can try it.  No matter, it is such a great recipe and you have some really good flours to work with.  (Rats, though...:o)

weavershouse's picture
weavershouse

I was writing my post 5 min. after you! Thanks for the quick reply. 

OH, now I see that sentence!! I never skimmed that bad before!    Maybe I had flour in my eyes or it was too early...or too late. What can I say but Thanks for the help.                                                                                     weavershouse