Using parchment paper for pizza
Yesterday, I baked a couple of pizzas using the method from Ken Forkish's book, Flour, Water, Salt Yeast, and I had a near disaster transfering the pizza from the peel to the hot stone in the oven. What haopened was the dough partially stuck to the peel, and when I struggled to thrust it in the oven, the pizza became mangled. But then even worse was that when I attempted to take it out when when it was done, it then stuck to the stone because of the cheese that went flying when putting the pie in! My second pizza worked a little better, but still I had some sticking problemS. The thing is this pizza was really good- probably one of the best in terms of taste and texture that I have ever made, and I don't want to give up Forkish's technique.
His technique is to bake it on the hot stone for 5 minutes and then broil it for 2. In the past, I would have just formed the pizza on parchment paper and baked the the pizza on the stone with the parchment underneath, but I am concerned that with my oven up to 550 and then on broil, the paper might desintergrate and/or ignite. Have any of you tried doing this? If this is not an option, I may try using some semolina on the peel next time to see if that helps.
i will appreciate any suggestions. Thank you.
I used parchment under the pies at 550F and skipped the par bake step. The exposed parchment got very dark and crispy but didn't cause any problems.
Paul
Paul- So you had the parchment underneath when you broiled the pizza? Or did you need to remove the paper before broiling?
Thank you.
Caryn
And didn't bother with the broiler. The pizzas turned out quite nicely without the extra fiddling.
Paul
Paul- Again, thanks for your input. I did like the slight char that the broiling added to the pizza. I will do some tests the next time I make a pizza.
I use a good dusting of flour + semolina on the workbench when preparing pizza and on the peel - that helps a lot. Speed too. however I also use silicone baking sheets - especially for big boulles of bread - these, like parchment are virtually transparent to the heat off the stone and very easy to transfer from workbench via peel to the stone in the oven. You might miss something by not being in direct contact with the stone, but it won't be the instant heat. The big advantage of silicone is that it lasts forever (well at least 6 months of daily use here!)
There's also something called the superpeel but I feel it's a bit expensive for what we're doing here...
-Gordon
Gordon- I am not sure what you mean by silicone baking sheets. Are you talking about something like Silpat?
Thanks.
Yes - silpat (after I googled it) appears to be a brand name for a woven fibreglass matting with silicone coating. There are many products that are (or appear to be) very similar. The stuff I last used came on a roll to be cut to size. I don't mean the baking trays that are made from silicone with a wire surround.
Seems some are PTFE coated rather than silicone, but I imagine the net result is the same.
-Gordon
I do Forkish's pizza with the parchment underneath for the first 5 min then remove it - the edges do get brown but I haven't had it combust yet - I think my oven maxes out at 500 though.
i may just try that technique next time. Thank yo.
Just an FYI - This is generally called Grilling this side of the pond... Broiling isn't a word used here at all.
Last pizza I made, (just over a week ago) the thermostat (& main element it turned out!) had gone, so I heated the whole thing up via the top grill heater and the fan. The Pizza stone did get quite hot via direct heat off the grill and it made a couple of nice crispy base pizzas.
I didn't realise both the fan element had gone as well as the thermostat - put in a new thermostat to find it still cold - fortunately spares are easy to get and fit.
-Gordon
I use parchment with the parchment with the pizza as well, in the summer I cook the pizza on the BBQ and here is a little video I made a few years back.
http://youtu.be/jHQk9xy3_fA
Gerhard
Thanks for sharing your video, Gerhard.
broiling. The crust is set so it shouldn't be a problem.
Thank you all for responding to my questions so quickly. It sounds like the best procedure might be to put the pizza on the stone with the parchment and remove it before broiling. I will give this a whirl next pizza bake. And now I know that "broil" is not a word in the UK!
I never use paper - only even PTFE sheets... easy to use, easy to clean, never any sticking to peel on or the baking stone.
Round cake tin sheets (from Aldi!) are the perfect size...
Make the dough in the mixer, divide onto the floured PTFE sheets, roll out with the proper shaped wooden rolling pin... add toppings - slide straight into the oven...and strainght out again 10 minutes or so later...
Here's one I made last night - sorry can't find hoiw to add a photo
Regards
Chris
Chris- It looks like I have alternatives. I can either improve my technique or look for PTFE. I am not sure what that is, but am going to look it up. Thank you.
Caryn
Chris- I just look this up. I am not sure this Teflon product is really that safe to use above 500 degrees.
I put the dough in a 500 degree oven for 7 minutes.
I take it out then do my toppings This time I put the pizza in on sheet of parchment because the cheese will drip off and smoke the kitchen to high heaven. Yeah the parchment gets brown (Fahrenheit 451!) but its worth it.
I made a 1/4" thick pizza "steel" as I have cracked way too many stones. Very happy with the steel.
Corn meal too smokey I agree, but a bit of rice flour is a little better to ease the dough into the oven. I use sparingly whatever I use. Also I find my oak peel is better than the poplar or birch ones cause the wood is less spongy.
is the answer to this problem. It is the best for home use getting pizza into an oven with no mess
and it is easy to use. I think they sell them on Amazon here
http://www.amazon.com/EXO-Super-Pizza-Solid-White/dp/B001T6OVPO
Baliw2- I am already aware of the superpeel, but I am trying to see if I really need to add yet another tool to my kitchen. I somehow feel that I should be able to bake pizza with the tools that I already have. If all else fails for me, I could consider it.
Caryn
Another thing that you can do is baking the pizza directly on the floor of the electric oven (250C) about 4-5 mins with parchment paper, and then transfer to the tray at the higher possition to melt the cheese (one minute). I usually put some corn semolina between pizza dough and paper, so the pizza is crunchier.
pizza screens? Look like pizza pans but are large mesh screens with a metal rim.
I even own a couple of screens, but never thought to use them. I may consider.
Thank you,
Caryn
+1 on pizza screens. They are very inexpensive and extremely effective. They also help you shape a perfectly round pie.
When shaping my pizza base I flour my board with 50/50 mix of cornmeal and rice flour to keep the stickiness at bay. Once the base is 75% or more of actual size, I place it on the screen and continue to stretch it there. A good screen has a grippy mesh that makes stretching easy.
I bake for 5min on the screen, then remove the screen (98% of the time it comes off with no problem), and bake for remaining 2 min directly on sheet steel or baking stone.
Friday night for years now. My dough is about 10% wetter than the Forkish recipe. I actually form the pizza by draping it over a large bowl on the counter and cover it with plastic wrap and allow gravity,time and gentle persuation to make the perfect circle. Preheat 525-550 1 hour with a stone or steel. All my toppings are at the ready measured and in bowls. When I am ready to bake I liberally flour what will be the bottom of the pizza followed by semolina or cornmeal. Flop it onto my aluminum peel top it quickly...do the jiggle test as Scott describes above and slide immediately onto the stone or steel. 6-8 minutes perfect pizza. I do use parchment for most of my bread bakes that go off about 450-490 and for quite a bit longer than 8 minutes...most 35-45. While no parchment has ever ignited even with the longer bake time it does appear to come awfully close and makes quite a mess. As you so aptly stated they do not use parchment in a commercial pizzeria and I am certain if you practice this method you can master it in no time at all.
Fotomat1- I am blown away by your bowl method. I may have to try that. That seems so smart. That way you can easily flour the dough without having to put it on the counter, only to have to pick it up agai. I will definitely give your technique a whirl. Thank you.
Caryn
I use parchment to shape and bake. Since a rectangular pizza bothers me not at all and gives me the most efficient use of my rectangular baking stone, I put a dab of oil on the paper, stretch the dough, top the pizza, scootch the peel under the whole everloving mess, slide 'er in and bake til done. Often I'll extract the paper about half way thru so I can reuse it for the next pizza. Works like a charm. Since the dough is covering all the paper, it barely gets brown.
I want to thank all of you who gave me really good tips for transferring the pizza to the oven. Today, I carefully floured and dusted my wooden peel with semolina flour, formed my dough on the floured counter, and then transferred the dough to the peel. I topped it, checking to make sure there was no sticking, and the pizza went onto the stone like a dream. I am so encouraged to make this a regular habit.
By the way I made a roasted butternut squash pizza with smoked Gouda and mozzarella.
OMG!!! This one looks so delicious! Well done!
Thank you, That pizza picture is now 5 years old! Now I am inspired to make that version again! Lately I have been making pan pizza which is even easier but still very good.
—Caryn
well done :)
very nice indeed!!!
Thank you, my fellow pizza enthusiasts! I think the lesson here is to keep trying and practicing. Plus all of you gave me the confidence that it could be done.
I worked at a pizza shop many moons ago (1992 to 93) - at that place we used metal mesh gizmos for the initial bake. After the crust had browned a bit we'd lift the pie from the mesh and drop the pizza on the bricks.
At home I make pizza on-an-off, once a week was how I used to do it but now it's more like once a month. I put the pizza dough in a well-greased (with either olive oil or sometimes I use shortening) pizza baking sheet ... I bake pizza at 550dF and after about 5 minutes of baking I take the pizza out of the oven, remove it from the sheet, put it on the peel, and then drop the pizza on the baking stone.
I've used this technique for about 20 years and it works like a champ.
Cheers-
Dave
Dave- Thanks for your recommendation. Since I was successful just using a well-floured and semolina dusted peel, I will probably stick with it unless it starts to fail, but I am curious what type of pizza baking sheet that you use.
Thank you,
Caryn
They're simple sheet metal, 1 ply (not hollow) pans with a lip. I think they're steel (I know they're not aluminum).
Something like 14" in diameter.
I can take a pic if you'd like.
-Dave
never mind
Is your pan a pan or a pizza screen?
What I have been using the last 20 years are actually pans.
Now that I've learned that I can get the screens on Amazon - I might get a few.
-Dave
They are called pizza screens, as I referenced above.
Here is an example: http://www.amazon.com/Winware-16-Inch-Seamless-Aluminum-Screen/dp/B001CI8VHS
Thank you. I actually already own some!
I used to have excellent results getting a pizza to glide off a peal. . Then I seemed to lose my mojo. A friend pointed out that I was using stoneground cornmeal that is irregular in shape so not acting as ball bearings to roll the dough off onto the stone. I bought some quaker brand cornmeal and had a much easier time. That being said, unless I'm making really small pizzas I find it easier to use parchment. I cook them for a few minutes to firm them up on the parchment and then using the peel can easily lift them off the parchment, remove it, and cook directly on the stone.
I wonder if anyone here bakes pizza in a convection oven but using convection roast rather than convection bake. Convection roast employs heat both from the bottom of the oven and the broiler. I'm wondering if I can do that, and where I should be positioning the pan. I'm using a recipe from Jenny Jones that gives the dough a long ferment -- it's too wet to roll but you pat it onto a cast iron frying pan -that's oiled. I also sprinkle corn meal generously. You then heat the pan on a burner for a couple of minutes before transferring it to a hot oven.