The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Sharing my tool for experimentation and collaboration with bread! Questions for you!

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keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

Sharing my tool for experimentation and collaboration with bread! Questions for you!

Dear fellow bakers!

I built a tool a few months ago to help me both stay on task while baking and log my experiments as I changed subtle parts of my process.

  • SMS alerts at the end of each step
  • Modify recipes on each batch
  • Log results and get feedback from friends / community.

 

Anyways, I've been using it and really enjoying it so I decided to add to it and open it up to others.

You can find it here - feel free to play around, add a recipe -- and I should note, it works on your phone! etc: http://www.getleaven.com/ 

Some questions for you!

  1. As you make bread, what do you currently log on paper, spreadsheet etc? (temperature, timing, baking percentages (water/flour %), recipe changes?)
  2. Do you find this tool interesting / helpful?  What would you change?

Thanks so much!

---

A line or two about me - - My career spans professional kitchens as a line cook to the tech industry working as product manager (microsoft, change.org). I still cook for events and roommates - dinners, bread, charcuterie etc etc. and would love to figure out how to share the tech + food products I build with larger communities of people who make great food at home. 

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

Is it possible to add a sign in with google too? I don't really want to get a facebook, but I am certainly quite intrigued by the idea..

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

I've gotten that feedback - Facebook Login was quite easy to implement so that's what I went with.  However, I will go ahead and implement both Google and Twitter login tonight and I'll get back to you?

 

 

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

Than you so much!

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

Hey!  I just wired up Google login so you should be all set.  Please let me know what you think!

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

I noticed you can't delete ingredients if you made a mistake.

 

Could you fix that?

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

Thanks again for the feedback!

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

I'll be your first "tester" and notify you of things I notice that could be improved.

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

I see you already ran into a bug with your ingredients.  I'm going to go ahead and make sure that can't happen (with that extra lingering value!)

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

Can you make that editable, too? The main problem I see is the lack of editability once you make things happen.

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

I will make editable steps this evening.

Bakers percentages - requires a little thought but it's high on my list!

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

That would be a nice feature.

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

I love the fact that the program automaticaly saves my changes. That's great!

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

Thanks!  Keep in mind - this is a very early release of this tool  

It pains me to use it as it is now - but It'll be getting so much better in the coming days and weeks.

PS - editing on steps is working now.  However, you'll notice that the "planned time" is not populating.  When you edit the step you have to reset the time.  (only temporary!)

golgi70's picture
golgi70

The grading system is a bit confusing.  The first question suggests 5 being too moist while in the header a 5 is best.  I just added a description instead.  PS I can add photos in "My Bake" but not a header photo for the main page.  

Cool Page for Sharing

Josh

golgi70's picture
golgi70

When selecting units of time it won't allow for a range of time which is sometimes more appropriate.  Maybe you can allow it go through with whatever is typed in the box.  This way the best possible information is passed along.  Just an idea

Josh

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

I'd suggest selecting an estimated time when creating a step.  And then in the description of the step, specify a range.  Obviously, when someone runs a batch of the product they will press start and stop when they finish.  Over time the application will learn that for this product, most people are taking x amount of time on the step and having solid outcomes and so it will suggest a range.

I'm going to hold off on doing work on this just yet!  Thanks so much for the feedback Josh.  I really appreciate it.

golgi70's picture
golgi70

As simple as 1-10 with 10 being the ideal for said loaf. 1 being the worst. Then a description for each. So it can be verbally defined by users. ie the crumb should be very moist and almost creamy. 

I'm excited to see where this goes. 

it would be nice in bp%. I second the option for 2 or maybe even 3 or 4 formulas to be able to seperate pf, soakers from final dough.  Maybe too elaborate. 

Josh

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

I would love to hear any thoughts you have on how to do the grading a bit better.  

I should update the descriptions on those ratings.  In the end I though - rate each of them on a scale of 1-5 on the quality of the outcome on that metric.  So, 5 on moisture would be - - it's perfectly moist for this type of bread.  And then you could tally up each of the scores and have a "perfect score".  Otherwise you get into a game of comparing apples and oranges, different metrics having different measurement.

Those are my thoughts - what do you have in mind?

 

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

I will definitely add product photos!  I'll do that tonight actually - - so that photo will show up on the main page and the sub page for the product.

On a given batch you can add photos at each step as well as photos in the results area.  When the batch is marketed complete, these results and photos move to the top of the batch.

Shai's picture
Shai

A few ideas:

Allow renaming of recipe.

Option to scale recipe when making a batch (no calc = ☺).

Maybe an option to attach ingredients to steps, so they will appear where they belong. A complete formula can be auto generated.

Dividing ingredients to groups (preferments, final dough, toppings, etc.).

 

I really like this concept and would like to see it getting developed, I think it will be a great tool for many bakers - it has a huge potential.

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

1) Product Names will be editable here shortly.  I will make that change when I enable users to add a photo to represent the recipe.  

2) Scaling a recipe!  This is super easy to do! Because of how I have set up the amounts to be actual numbers / integers, I can easily do that.

A follow up question here is: should ingredients also appear on the screen where you create a batch?  Im thinking that at the top of the batch screen you could click on a link for ingredients and it would expose your list with a little field to scale up or down.

3) Ingredients on steps - Totally get your reasoning here. This will be a feature to come in the future.  (given all I have to improve, I think this might be in the "nice to have bucket"). 

Ingredients into groups - - I love how my favorite cookbooks do this and it's simple to do.  The only issue here is complexity, creating a nice experience for the user to put ingredients into groups at any point, etc.

Shai - I really appreciate the feedback.  I'm going to work hard on Leaven this weekend to resolve atleast some of the points you raise.  I definitely appreciate your patience (and interest!).

 

-Wilson

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

This is coming!  Working on it this afternoon.

Feedback, much appreciated.

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

That would be a nice feature- a compacted visual timeling.

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

After you start your first step (in a batch), a link should appear at the top that says "full schedule" - -that should layout the schedule for that batch.

 

Let me know if you have any problems!

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

Apparently I could delete your image of the country bread if I wanted to. Might want to fix that.

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

So, I went ahead and pushed out photos for recipes/products last night and didn't add permissions to deleting and adding photos.  (it was quite late... )  

But!  it should be fixed now and mobile layouts on the project page should look good again.

 

Thanks again for reporting bugs!

amberartisan's picture
amberartisan

I do like the "batches" idea- that way other people can produce and evaluate your products. This app has great potential! Also, a site search/ category folders might be needed once your site really gets going...

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

Ingredients for each step should be up!  But, unfortunately -  I'll need you to update the recipes!

You can add ingredients to the step by clicking edit next to each step or the big button that should appear in the ingredients section.

Deleting ingredients and changing Recipe names will be coming up next, followed by bakers percentages.

Thanks again - enjoy!

 

Shai's picture
Shai

Iv'e updated my recipe. Again, thanks for spending your time working on this tool.

A couple of things that bother me:

Time durations in the recipe are rounded - 1.5 hours is displayed as 2 hours. 

It would be nice is to be able to edit ingredients and change notes after adding them.

 

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

It's been so fun to work on.  I really hope I can make something valuable for you guys.  Josh linked me over to the BBGA formulas and guidelines this morning - inspired a better way to show baking percentages etc on each recipe.  So much to do!

To the points you raise:

Time Durations

  • I'm using something that humanizes the duration (ends up rounding it) and takes care of basic things like pluralizing the world "minutes" when necessary.  I agree, it's a problem and I'll add it to my list.

Edit ingredients:

  • You can edit ingredients at each step by just adding the same ingredient again with an updated amount.

Deleting ingredients from a step

  • Coming this evening!  You'll just be able to click a little trash can next to the ingredient.  Only the owner of the recipe will see these trash cans.

Ingredients viewable when running a batch -

  • Coming this evening. You'll see them at each step.

Changing recipe names and deleting recipes

  • Editing recipes names will come tonight, but deleting recipes is another beast.  I don't want people to delete a recipe if another user has created batches of that recipe - that wouldn't be very nice.

-Wilson

 

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

Time durations are now exact!

Commenting on each "completed" batch is also enabled.  Batch owners will be alerted via email to new comments on their batches.

 

Thanks again for the feedback,

-Wilson

keenanwl's picture
keenanwl

  • Faster Loading Images
  • Share your batch with others, Leaven won't force them to login to view it.  You'll only have to login to create products / batches
  • Redesign the completed view of a batch so it highlights what actually changed

A question that has been coming up again and again is around "batches".  People don't seem to understand the idea of "creating a batch" of a particular recipe.  Does anyone have thoughts on terminology that might work better?  Or conceptually, a way I can explain it more clearly?

Looking forward to getting back to improving this app!