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%starter in dough

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Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

%starter in dough

Okay I've been making a yeasted 1.6kg dough at 60% hydration.  To transform it into a sourdough, I found this at Wiki:

"...Finally, the starter is mixed with flour and water to make a dough of the desired consistency. The starter weight is usually 13 to 25% of the total flour weight, though formulas may vary.[31][38][39] ..."

Would that % of starter be in the ballpark for sourdough?

adri's picture
adri

This depends on your recipe.

On some recipes I'd use 533g Sourdough - or as much sourdough at 100% hydration as flour in the final dough. After mixing, the fermentation would be just 45' to 2 hours max - no bulk fermentation. The aroma building fermentation would already have happened in the sourdough built.

On other recipes I'd just use 32g Sourdough and let the whole dough ferment over night.

How much yeast do you use and how do you do the proofing?

 

One rule I start my experiments with: 7g instant dry yeast = 21g fresh yeast = 150g active sourdough.

 

Adrian

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

In order to open the crumb even white SD seems to be at least 72% hydration.

But, you can shoot for 20% of the total and flour weight of the dough to be SD levain at 100% hydration.  10% if you want things to slow down and develop more flavor or up ton30% or more if you want to speed things up and still get some SD tang.

At 1,000 g loaf might have 200g of levain that was built in 3 stages over 8-12 hours using 10-20 g of starter.

Happy Baking

Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

Okay my OP has been edited.

As to yeast, for a 1.6kg dough I use a pinch, approx 1/8th tsp SAF Red and allow to ferment:

  • 12 hours approx with diastatic malt added
  • 18 hours without malt

 

adri's picture
adri

One rule I start my experiments with: 7g instant dry yeast = 21g fresh yeast = 150g active sourdough.

 

It pretty much depends on how active your starter is and the temperature of you environment.

Craig has a quite good prediction model for pizza (Not taking in account the hydration of course, but yours might fit). My starter is more active and needs less time. For most starters it should work: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=22649.0

Adrian

Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

Alright, let me do some math and I'll get back to you to see if I've calculated the quantites of water, flour and levain, levain at 100% hydration.  Salt notwithstanding!  8)

Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

Final sourdough @ 75% hydration
Starter 10-30% @ 100% hydration

Final Dough = 1.75kg
20% Levain =  350g   ===> 175g flour + 175g water (these two ingredients constitute the final Levain)

1000g flour - 175g flour   in the Levain = 825g  flour
750g water - 175g water in the Levain = 575g water.

Alright here are the final quantities:

350g Levain @100% hydration

825g flour
575g Water.

 

 

 

 

Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

Thanks for looking.

Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

I wished I knew my way around this comment and editor better.  Sorry.

adri's picture
adri

Now that I see it: 1.6kg dough doesn't mean 1.6kg is 100% but was already 160%. My calculations were based on 1.6kg of flour.

 

10 to 30% is a) a wide range and b) too much for your 12 to 18 hours. At 22°C/72F room temperature I'd use up to 5% starter for 18 hours.

baybakin's picture
baybakin

When calcuating my sourdoughs, I usually use between 10-15% of the total flour weight in the preferment, depending on how fast i want the fermentation to go.  If i'm retarding the dough in the fridge, I'll use a number on the lower end.

So for a total of 500g flour in the entire dough, this would be between 50 and 75g of that flour being in the preferment.  Granted a 100% hydration starter, and using 15% prefermented flour that would make the dough look like this (75% hydration dough)
150g 100% hydration starter
300g Water
425g Flour
10g salt

For a 10% prefermented flour, the same bread would be like this:
100g 100% hydration starter
325g Water
450g Flour
10g salt

I would use the first one if I was baking the same day, and the second one if I'm baking tomorrow/the day after

 

Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

@Adri: the twelve to eighteen ferment that I stated in the fourth post is based on yeasted dough and not SD.  What I have upcoming is my first SD dough/loaf and I am looking for a starting point for flour, water, and levain using final dough weight of 1.75kg at 75% hydration as recommended for SD.  If you look at the math I'm working backwards.  8^)

Best,
Me

adri's picture
adri

And how much fermentation time will be your final result?

Bob Marley's picture
Bob Marley

It depends on how active the SD Levain.  Will place the entire dough in my banneton and will judge the rise from there.  And as you know it depends on how active the final Levain is which is something learned by experimentation.  Right now my initial mixture of HM Rye and water (with a bit of pineapple juice added) is incubating at 84F.