The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Stretch / Slap and Fold

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bobku's picture
bobku

Stretch / Slap and Fold

I have been using stretch and fold and slap and fold for a while now . I have noticed that the dough feels and acts like it has a higher hydration then when I use to do standard kneading.  I fine I can add slightly more flour and still get a great crumb and texture. Has anyone else also notice this

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bobku's picture
bobku

I find myself reducing hydration about 5% -10% to keep dough feelt he same as before

MichaelLily's picture
MichaelLily

I find that with stretch and fold I am able to increase hydration.  My current base is 85%, but the stretch and fold has worked so well that I feel very confident in upping it to even 95%.  

Perhaps the number of stretch and folds you are doing is the difference.  In my kitchen (~70-75F) it takes about 5 hours with stretch and fold every half hour.  For the first 2 hours the dough is extremely wet.  After that it becomes more workable and much more aerated.

 

PetraR's picture
PetraR

Wow, I never go over 65% Hydration. 

How can you handle such a wet dough?

MichaelLily's picture
MichaelLily

I do all of my stretch and folds in the bowl and I use wet hands.  The dough sticks somewhat for the first two hours, and then it doesn't stick at all as it becomes better developed.  It takes a lot of practice when it comes to forming loaves, but my beginnings were in a very wet pizza dough, so I've become accustomed to hydration over 70% over a few years.

PetraR's picture
PetraR

I do the same, I do the stretch and folds in the bowl and use wet hands. I do 6 Stretch and folds every 30 minutes for 3 hours, that is 6 stretch and folds.

I leave the dough in the same bowl to bulk ferment after the stretch and folds.

Even at * only * 65% Hydration it is a quite wet dough.

I use 500g of Strong Bread Flour and than use 350ml of warm water, that is a quite wet dough already, I can not see how one can shape an even wetter dough?

David Esq.'s picture
David Esq.

You are at 70% not 65%. 

So you are answering your own question when you shape it. :)

PetraR's picture
PetraR

Ooops lol, yes , so I am.

I must have gone up by 25ml of Water as I was on 325ml before.

No wonder my Dough felt a bit wetter.

MichaelLily's picture
MichaelLily

Ok I usually do 5kg of bread flour (12.9% protein) and 4kg of water, mix up and let it sit, and then add the other 250ml a half hour later with the salt.  Maybe the larger quantity makes it a bit easier?

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

with the larger quantity being easier to do S& F's at 9 KG than the 900 g of 1 loaf.?  I'll stick to the 1 loaf for easy since !'m retired:-) 

PetraR's picture
PetraR

I also stick to my small amounts.

I only do stretch and folds, but I understand he does stretch,slap and fold and I have no Idea how that works unless he portions the dough out before?

PetraR's picture
PetraR

Now that is a large amount of evertying lol.

How can you stretch, slap and fold that amount?

I just do the stretch and fold of my little dough in the bowl.

I would LOVE to make larger Quantities but I do not have a Freezer to store my bread and, we do not eat that much bread when 2 of my boys are at Uni.

MichaelLily's picture
MichaelLily

I was unacquainted with the stretch, slap, and fold.  I too only stretch and fold.  Almost exactly the same as Chad Robertson in this video: http://youtu.be/cIIjV6s-0cA?t=1m53s

With the large quantity I use the big bin.

MichaelLily's picture
MichaelLily

And I am fortunate enough to have an extra freezer dedicated to bread.

bobku's picture
bobku

I use stretch and fold for all my breads. I even use it for Bagel dough as low as 50% hydration, then it's more of pull and fold but I get much better gluten development than actual kneading a lot easier also. Great see thru window pane everytime

PetraR's picture
PetraR

I use stretch and fold also, all the time for all the breads I bake.

 

PetraR's picture
PetraR

I soooo want an extra freezer for my baking

David Esq.'s picture
David Esq.

How many breads would you freeze? The longer they are frozen, the less good they are when they are thawed, no? I suppose they will always be better than store-bought, I can't help but think that the quality would degrade enough that when you ate a loaf recently baked you'd wonder why you've been eating frozen bread all of this time....

PetraR's picture
PetraR

We are a family of 6 so you can imagine that we go through a lot of Bread, not just Sourdough Bread.

I have often 2 loafes of Sourdough Bread in the little Freezer I have.

It tastes just the same when you freeze it as soon as it is cooled after Baking and let it defrost at Room Temperature.

Even the crust is still WONDERFUL and it does not at all looses it taste.

I use Freezer Bags to freeze my bread in and Store it in also.

David Esq.'s picture
David Esq.

I bet you need an extra freezer for more than just bread!  Only two of us eat my bread in my house and I have thought about a second freezer myself, just so I don't have to bake every week.  But I thought if the bread was frozen for more than two weeks it would be noticeably drier.   I double wrap and then put in a freezer bag before freezing, but I haven't stored anything long term in the freezer.  If I had a family of six, I would definitely consider that second freezer more carefully.

PetraR's picture
PetraR

I hope we get a chest freezer in a couple of month time.

I just let my Bread cool completely after baking, put it in a freezer bag and freeze it.

I found one in my freezer that I put in 3 weeks ago * I put the day of freezing on it * and it must have been pushed to the back.

It was YUMMY and not at all dry.

I think the key is to really let it defrost at room temperature.

My husband once wanted to speed it up and sliced it when it was still not 100% defrosted, and that was when the taste and the crust gone downhill big time.