The Fresh Loaf

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Mixing speed.

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clearlyanidiot's picture
clearlyanidiot

Mixing speed.

Sorry ahead of time if this has already been discussed elsewhere, I didn't see any search results that quite answered my question.

In Suas book Advanced bread and pasty. He mentions the formula for calculation mixing times, but most of them call for a certain amount of time in second gear. Looking at the manual for my Hobart A 200 most of the recommended dough capacities specify 1st gear only.

Is there any reason to use second gear when mixing dough in a planetary mixer?

golgi70's picture
golgi70

It will take more time but you can mix in speed 1 the whole way. Speed 2 is used to develop gluten Once all ingredient are well incorporated. Your friction factor may be reduced when calculating DDT if you only mix in speed 1. Plus u may need more strethch and folds as well. I mix in speed 2 on a mixer that says the same thing. never higher than 2 though with stiff dough. 

Not suggesting you do as I don't want you to hurt your machine but I think it's mostly the company protecting themselves. Dough is tough on mixers hence the creation of spiral mixers just for dough. 

Hope this is helpful

josh

clearlyanidiot's picture
clearlyanidiot

I kinda figured it was a liability thing to say 1st speed only, as load is really variable between volume, hydration, speed and increased potential for breaking something. 

What type of mixer do you use?

ananda's picture
ananda

Hi,

I believe you need to give thought to the formula in question when it comes to any type of dough mixing.   I mix in a Hobart 20 quart mixer....like yours.

Stiff doughs may be tougher on the machine, but lack of water necessitates more mixing time to develop the gluten.   Ask yourself how much development you want in each dough...Suas quantifies this, as he uses 3 different degrees of mixing; short, improved and intensive

Most of my dough is mixed akin to "improved", and I would use both first and second speeds to achieve this.   The obvious exception I have is when I work with local flours, which are weak and cannot cope with the intensity of the second speed.   I generally mix these around 7-8 minutes on first speed.   however, I also employ 2 hour autolyse of dough flour, and that has significant impact in reducing final mix time.

Josh is on the right lines, but to clarify...my mixer was made in 1957.   I don't think the flour in the UK was necessarily so strong back then, and vital dry gluten and strengthening bread improvers were not commonplace either [Chorleywood Process began in 1963].   However, these mixers are obviously built to last, in contrast to modern home-kitchen machines!

Best wishes

Andy 

clearlyanidiot's picture
clearlyanidiot

I should really re-read the book, as the first time I read it I didn't have a mixer, so really wasn't paying too much attention to anything to do with mechanical help.

 

Would it make sense that second speed is used to help speed up mixing in a commercial environment where time = money?

Part of the reason I was wondering about second speed is that my mixer had sat for years and was making a grinding sound when I got it. After pulling it apart and regreasing it the sound went away, but second gear won't work, or if I flip one spacer around, second gear works, but 1st wont. It's kinda strange that 1 and 3 work or 2 and 3, but still no luck getting 1, 2, and 3 to work.

They're amazing machines. The one I have looks quite beaten up around where the bowl touches the frame, but internally aside from a some sparkly grease, that was probably original from the factory, the gears showed virtually no wear. 

ananda's picture
ananda

No not really in this case.   It is about the amount of energy imparted into the dough.   Hence industrial bread is manufactured using high speed mixers which callibate the energy input during mixing rather than using time as a base.

I think you should get the machine fixed.   It probably needs a new clutch, that's all.   Give Hobart a ring.

Best wishes

Andy