The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

KitchenAid mixing times

eb16's picture

KitchenAid mixing times

I would really appreciate some help with my new KitchenAid Artisan mixer. I have made a couple of different types of bread in it and each time the dough appeared overmixed after a couple of minutes, even though that could be because the first time it didn't seem to knead so well so the next time I used the autolyse method in the beginning. Then after about 3 oif 4 minutes of kneading (speed 2 like the manual says) the dough became shiny and sticky. I am obviously failing at seeing the dough development before this happens, and although I do understand that this is a matter of experience, I really need someone's advice because I don't want this to happen again. And I don't want to knead with my hands as I need to do as little as possible with them due to health problems.

These are the recipes (from J. Hamelman's Bread) I use most often, usually one small loaf:

Ciabatta with stiff biga - 73% hydration (500g four, 365g water; of that 100g flour and 60g water pre-ferment)

Rustic bread 69% hydration (320 bread + 40g rye + 40g whole-wheat flour and 276g water; of that 150g flour and 90g water for pre-ferment)

If you are an experienced KitchenAid user, please let me know how you use it, perhaps with your tested recipes. Many thanks!

pmiker's picture

I use a KA Pro 600 and I would suggest that you start with a basic recipe.  Mix the dry ingredients with the dough hook or beater blade.  Add the liquid, use the dough hook and mix on speed one until things are fairly well mixed.  Switch to speed 2 and time it for 2 minutes.  Then look at the dough.  It should be kneaded fairly well.  It may take a bit longer  but in just two minutes you should notice the dough change.  If you like, you can leave the dough, covered, in the bowl for about 20 minutes and then knead on speed 2 for another 30 seconds.  This should let you see how a dough comes together using the KA.

If you do not have a basic recipe, I have a fool proof partial whole wheat recipe that works with this method.


tgrayson's picture

You're not gonig to overknead a bread in four minutes on speed 2 in a KA. Forget the shiny and sticky, what is the resulting bread like?

LindyD's picture

Not sure which edition of Bread  you have, if the first edition, page 11 contains mixing  guidelines and mixing times for stand mixers (such as your KA Artisan).  It's on page 12 in the second edition.

BTW, if you are computing the DDT (desired dough temp) mentioned in each formula, use 26 for your mixer's friction factor.  That number is accurate for the Artisan as well as the Bosch compact.

eb16's picture

Mike, I will have a look at your basic recipe, if you don't mind posting it. Thanks.

I read through Hamelman's Bread (I think it's the 1st edition) again, and looked at the recommendtions for mixing times before I started using my KA. I am really confused at the moment.

The shiny and sticky dough - I never saw dough behave like this after hand kneading. My understanding (again, based on Hamelman's book) was that this means that the dough is overworked and the water is being realeased back.

I would normally knead less (with my hands), then fold twice. After the KA mixing, I didn't dare fold in case it would make it worse. The bread was edible but not marvellous with shiny crumb. Oven spring wasn't great.

davidg618's picture

My mixer is a KitchenAid Pro 600.

Final Dough for my "go-to" sourdough is 68% Hydration, 10%/45%/45%-Whole Rye/KA AP/KA Bread flours. 14% of the Bread Flour is prefermented in a 100% Hydrated formula-ready sourdough levain.

When I'm not going to retard the dough DDT is 76°F

For a bread very similar to your Rustic bread, posted above--and, by the way it doesn't get much simpler than your Rustic bread for "basic", I'd stick with it.--I mix the flour, water and levain until its just combined. Using a bowl scraper I collect the shaggy mixture into a ball, sprinkle the salt on top of the dough ball and autolyse for 1 hour. The purpose of sprinkling the salt on top prevents a common mistake: forgetting to add the salt before the first kneading.

After autolyse I knead the dough, with a spiral dough hook, on speed 1 for 2 minutes--I use a timer for precision--then I increase to speed 2 and knead for 3 additional minutes. I transfer the dough to a lightly oiled container and rest for 30 mins. to 45 mins. I then perform 3 bench Stretch and Folds with 30 to 45 mins. rest between S&F's. I find with this mix of machine kneading, S&F and rests I can feel the dough's strength, elasticity, and tenacity improve with each S&F.

When I retard this dough (15hours @ 54°F) DDT is set at 54°F using ice water, and refrigerating the dough beginning with autolyse and ending when the DDT is achieved. Then it is transferred to a wine cooler set at 54°F. I increase rest time between S&F's to 1 hour. Machine kneading times remain the same.

Baguette dough @ 67% hydration (all AP flour and commercial yeast or sourdough levain) I treat exactly the same way as my "go-to" sourdough regardless if made as a straight dough, with poolish or sourdough levain; retarded or not.)

All doughs I make I hydrate for 1 hour.

Doughs with 50% WW flour (same final hydration) I increase the speed 2 knead to 7 mins.

Doughs with 72% hydration, or greater, I knead 10 mins. (or longer).

Another trick you can use with high hydration doughs is hold back 10% of the water, knead until the gluten network gains strength, then add the remaining water.

If you want further details--and I believe the key to consistent, successful bread baking is in the details--here are two previous blog entries that might be of interest. Or look through dmsynder's or txfarmer's indices. They have been two of my principle mentors along my baking journey.

Happy baking,

David G