The Fresh Loaf

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Tears before bedtime - sad sourdough again

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JOHN01473's picture
JOHN01473

Tears before bedtime - sad sourdough again

Having carefully nurtured my latest Sourdough bake the final product is again disappointing. Although it has a good crust the crumb is still a little wet and sticky and the loaf is quite heavy. There was not a lot of oven spring.
This is all very disappointing as I invested a lot of care. I make the sponge in the evening of day 1 then bulk up and bake on day 2.

I would really like an "all in one day recipe" - I have been looking at Dan Lepard's "White Levain bread" recipe.

Can anyone recommend this or another reliable recipe.

Thanks
John - The Baking Bear

 

 

Juergen Krauss's picture
Juergen Krauss

Hi John,

Although I have been baking rye sourdoughs for a while I had huge trouble getting white sourdoughs to work - until I came across this:

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/28211/benefits-hand-mixing-bread

Great recipe, and the bit of rye in the starter seems to do the trick.

Cheers,

Juergen 

JOHN01473's picture
JOHN01473

Hi Juergen,

thanks - i followed the link - signed up and then got "access denied"

John

Juergen Krauss's picture
Juergen Krauss

It seem they have taken the article off :-(

J

JOHN01473's picture
JOHN01473

thanks

i will check through D Snyder's recipes.

 

J

polo's picture
polo

If you promise to keep in mind that I am not used to publishing recipes, I will try and give you mine:)

I bake 24 to 36 loaves of white sourdough each week, so keep in mind that this is a scaled down version. I also retard my loaves overnight, but I am sure that this recipe is capable of making a same day dough. The recipe is in bakers percentage.

Flour - 100% (90% AP, 10% whole wheat)

Starter - 30% (100% hydration starter, mine is fed with roughly 15% rye flour and 85% AP)

Liquid - 72% (55% water, 17% evaporated milk)

salt - 2%

Method:

-Mix starter and water, breaking up the starter.

-Add flour and mix by hand into a cohesive mass.

-Autolyze for 1 hour

- Add salt and mix by hand (stretch and fold) for about 5 minutes.

-Stretch and fold every 15 to 20 minutes over the next 2 to 2 1/2 hours.

-Bulk rise for two hours

-Shape loaves and proof until dough passes poke test. (probably 2 to 3 hours, but depends on the speed of your starter)

-Bake - I bake in a wood fired oven and start my first load at about 540 F for 30 minutes. If I were using my indoor oven, I would probably use a stone and run the oven at 450 for 35 minutes or until done.

A couple of notes: My starter is fed once per day at a 1-4-4 ratio and matures in about 12 hours. I use my starter about an hour shy of mature if I can.

The water in the starter is included in the recipe hydration ( so if your recipe will use 100 grams of starter 50 grams of your water is coming from your starter)

Hope this helps you.

JOHN01473's picture
JOHN01473

Hi Polo,
thanks for your recipe - i will definitely give it a go.
maybe the retard would be the next stage.
between which stages do you retard?
do you alter the recipe because of the retard?
can i be cheeky and ask for your recipe with the retard and any change you make to account for that step.
John

 

polo's picture
polo

Nothing different in the recipe. After I shape the loaves, I put them in bannetons, cover them with tea towels,  put the bannetons in plastic grocery bags, and set them in a cold spot (40 t0 50 F) for about 12 hours. This time of year my garage is the perfect temperature. When the weather gets warmer I am going to have to invest in a cool closet of some sort. I'm afraid our basement refrigerator isn't big enough for 24 loaves at 2lbs each.

For a few loaves you can use your refrigerator,  just turn the temp up a bit.  I typically try and let the loaves warm inside for about an hour before baking. I am sure you'll have to adjust your rising times for your own starter and the temperatures in your home. For me it always seems best to bake when the loaves are a little underproofed, rather than past their prime.

Good luck and if you have more questions I'll answer as best I can.

JOHN01473's picture
JOHN01473

thanks

i cant imagine 20 loaves at a time.

J

 

tracker914's picture
tracker914

I'm no expert and have been lurking around here for a while and finally decided to join, but you can try this out as it's been working pretty well for me.

I bake this once a week in my wood fired oven even in winter(hudson valley NY), but I've also made this in my regular oven (Electric) on a baking stone. If your looking to make less just cut down the recipe, I've tried different variations with good results.

This recipe is about 6 times the original.

It makes 8 loaves @ appx 700 grams each and leaves about 230 grams of dough to be used as a starter for next time. I mix the sponge the night before.

Sponge: 2 cups KAF special and 2 cups water, mix well and then sprinkle some flour over the top, enough to cover, what now looks like poolish(the consistancy should be right around a slightly thick pancake batter. Cover it and Leave that to activate overnight in a warm place(top of frigde works well for me)).

The next morning mix the following 

3000 grams flour (I usually mix 2000 grams KAF special and 1000 grams durham semolina, but you can go with all KAF if you like)

2225 grams water

60 grams table salt.

add the sponge from the night before(should be nice and bubly by now)

Mix by hand just enough to get all the liquid and flour incorporated. Then just walk away and leave it alone for about 45 minutes.

Then use slap and fold to get it to start building up gluten. I usually do this 4 - 5 times, once every hour or 2, You'll know it's starting to look right when it starts stretching like mozzarella. You'll know when to stop during each fold, because the dough will start to get stiff and not really want to stretch, at that point just leave it alone again and come back later. When it's done bulk fermenting then cut appx 700 gram peices and gently shape and proof about 1.5 to 2 hrs. I use some bread baskets that I found at restaurant depot, I sprinkle the semolina flour into the basket and load the dough seam side down. Spinkle more flour over the top of the loaf and then cover with plastic and then a couple of table cloths and let rise. when your ready to bake preheat your oven to about 500 degrees or so with the stone in the oven, if you dont steam your bread, you really need to, this bread gets great oven spring from steam. I usually load my bread when the oven is around 580 degrees, it's just the way my WFO works. To load the loaves I sprinkle a coarse semolina on the top and then turn the loaves over onto a wood peel, slash them and put into the oven. After about 5 - 10 minutes you'll want to turn your oven temp down to around 460 or so(Trial and error as each oven is a little different). Bread should be around 205 - 210 internal temp or you can try the tap and sounds hollow method. Leave it to cool on a rack(if you can :). I'll be baking some this weekend and will upload some pics to give you a better idea of what I'm trying to describe. 

Angelo.

JOHN01473's picture
JOHN01473

thanks - it sounds like you have it well sorted out.

i will give it a try.

John

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

going so well and heading in the right direction.   Those great milled flours from Stanton must really be making the dough ferment and  develop very fast.  Sounds like overproofing with the no spring and slight gummy interior if it baked to the right temperature inside.

You really want to get it in the oven at 80-85% proof after panning.  Pan them up half full and when the top of the loaf in the middle gets 1/2" over the lip of the pan then bake them off.  With those great freshly milled flours the proof will be faster than you think.

I say don't worry about it - and Bake On!

JOHN01473's picture
JOHN01473

all taken in - being processed.

i will apply what you say to the next bake.

i think this double in size seems to be my downfall.

i will get in the zone with the bread next bake.