The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Soft & Voluminous Loaf

mwilson's picture
mwilson

Soft & Voluminous Loaf

Whenever I make bread my main goal is volume. Admittedly this isn't the most rewarding feature of bread but I am a technical junkie and love taking things to the limit. Not to mention, I love super-light bread.

This loaf is somewhat akin to the improved loaf I made a few months ago but uses acidity from sourdough to boost volume. Milk and diastatic malt are used to soften the crumb.


Ingredients:
320g Very strong Allinson flour (High gluten)
200g Water
200g Skimmed milk
153g 00 flour
~77g Italian sourdough (~45% hydration)
55g Wholemeal flour
22g White spelt
22g Red malt
10g Salt
6g Diastatic malt
2g Instant yeast

Method:
Mixed dry to wet. Fermented 3-4hrs @ ~30C until tripled. Kneaded by hand until satisfied, 5-10 mins á la Bertinet.

Rounded and left to rest for 20-30 mins at which point it was significantly swollen.

Shaped tightly and placed in the tin.

Proved for 45mins-1hr. Baked with steam, oven off for first 8 of a total 45mins.

Crumb:
  

 

Comments

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

I think you need bigger bread pans.  :)  

My first thought was to check the recipe for spelt.  Yup.  Big billowy tops is for me a sure sign.  The crumb shot shows larger bubbles on top and a density at the bottom.  Crust color is very even.  Good looking swirl in the middle.   Lovely crumb color.  I think there is a tad too much dough in the pan and I would also shorten the final proof by 15 min. to prevent the shrinking at the pan line.   

Sorry if I come across too critical.  Did you have any difficulty cutting thru the top half of the loaf?  What do you think contributed most to the lovely color?

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Mini - I didn't know spelt added to volume....Is there a certain percentage to use or is it always wanting to rise beautifully?

Janet

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

be as low as 2% (of the total flour weight)  and it doesn't seem to matter if it is whole or fine flour.

Play around and see what you think.

mwilson's picture
mwilson

Hi Mini.

Yes I agree, for this dough bigger pans would be ideal. This pan is not small though, bigger than average I'd say, holding 2.2 litres. 

Proof less? No sorry, I disagree. You can see that dough was under-proofed as it exploded on one side. I engineered this dough to have excellent gas retention properties. All loaves contract where the crust develops its just more noticable in the more voluminous ones. Not uncommon in commercial loaves where improvers have been used. 

I don't mind critisim becuase it can lead to a debate and I love those!

Difficulty cutting through the top? No.

Colour comes from the malt and my expert baking skills! ;)

Thanks for your review Mini.

Michael

ananda's picture
ananda

Hello Michael,

Since you are striving for loaf volume, it might be instructive to make a comparison with High Crown commercial sliced loaves.   Typically, they are scaled at around 920g, and placed in pans of around 2800ml in volume.

There is clearly too much dough in the tin for the loaf you exhibit here [1067g in 2200ml].   Scaling weight at around 750g would be more appropriate for these pans if you are aiming for really low density type of bread.

I note what you say about the slight lift on the crust indicating possible underproof; but the crumb shot photo does suggest the core of the loaf appears somewhat weaker than the rest of the loaf.   Ordinarily this could be taken as signs of over-extended proof.   However, the main point is to reduce the amount of dough in the pan.

Interesting formula; given the amylase content is adjusted at the mill, I suggest 1% diastatic malt is definitely too much.   Half that might be a more appropriate maximum now that fungal enzymes are added without the requirement of declaration.

Best wishes

Andy

mwilson's picture
mwilson

Hi Andy. Welcome back.

I have a loaf pan that holds 3.3 litres that I agree would be more suitable for this dough.

The level of proofing is somewhat subjective but for me this loaf was under-proofed for a number of reasons.

1. The dough only doubled in volume and this dough is perfectly capable of tripling and remaining stable.

2. The poke test showed strong spring back.

3. The ruptured side during the bake.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by saying the core could be weaker...? The dough is completely homogeneous. This density in the middle is more to do with heat transfer and crust formation timing during the bake. And possibly my shaping. If I had a full steam oven I'm sure this 'core' problem wouldn't exist.

Diastatic malt @ 1% could be too much but it all depends on the flour(s) used and what results one is after. Admittedly my use of it here was excessive but nothing to get in a twist about.

It's understandable that flour has to be adjusted with enzymes. Mass production demands consistency and so a consistent flour is required... Nature of the beast I guess! But that's a whole other discussion!

Nice to hear from you.

Cheers,

Michael

Mebake's picture
Mebake

I have Missed your earlier post, mwilson. what a nice loaf it was! Such lofty profile, and a delightful fluffy crumb.

Your loaf shown above is also very attractive. If i should bake a white bread, this would be high on my list. 

 

mwilson's picture
mwilson

I have likely missed much of your work too Khalid. I'll keep my eyes peeled.

Glad you enjoyed my lofty loaves. Honored that you've put it on your list!

Cheers,

Michael

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Wow, I would say you achieved you goal with this loaf!  How long did it stay soft and fresh?  I am thinking for awhile due to the sourdough added.

The use of malt, NDM or DM has always been a bit confusing to me.  Authors differ in their advise.  I always thought that DM was used as food for the yeast when a long fermentation period was called for.  I didn't know it is used to increase volume.....I have also read that too much malt can result in a gummy crumb.  You added both NDM and DM and your crumb looks just fine to me.  Do you know the proportions within which to stay so as not to get the gummy crumb?  (I am also thinking that it is the DM that causes the gummyness and that the NDM is just a sweetener and I see that your addition of DM is way less than the NDM.)  

Sorry to 'dump' my confusion onto you but you used both in your bread so I am hoping you can shed some light on my confused brain :-)

Thanks for your post and shots of your lovely bread.  Makes me want to get out my loaf pan and bake a loaf myself :-)

Take Care,

Janet

mwilson's picture
mwilson

Hi Janet,

I think I have. I was aiming for something of commercial volume. It's still soft but I can feel some coarseness as I cut through with a knife.

You're on the money about Malt. Don't be sorry, I'm always happy to help and explain the reason behind my choices.

Yeast can feed on three sugars directly, Malt, Fructose and Glucose. Adding any of these will allow the yeast to produce more gas.

Diastatic malt includes amylase enzymes (already present in flour and from yeast). Adding this ups the enzyme count and therefore starch can be converted into malt more rapidly. Yes using too much does indeed make the crumb gummy. My loaf could have used less as there was a hint of stickiness about it. Using no more than 1% is advisable.

Non-diastatic malt is typically used to add flavour but can be all gobbled up by the yeast given enough time.

Go ahead, get out that pan... :)

Thanks,
Michael

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Michael.

Thanks for the explanation about the malts and the 1% figure for DM. 

So the NDM adds flavor - a malt flavor?  Is that how they make the granary bread?  Soak wheat flakes or oatmeal in NDM? Does it add sweetness to like honey or sugar?

I already had a loaf planned for tomorrow but added 10% spelt to see how it effects the rise since Mini alluded to the fact that spelt contributes to a lofty loaf....Probably won't get the volume you did because it is being mixed with hard white ww flour but it will be fun to see what results.

Thanks again for the explanation.

Janet

mwilson's picture
mwilson

Hi Janet.

Granary includes malted wheat flakes. It's the process of Malting that creates the maltose sugar. Malt is sweet and has a very moreish quality - my cat loves it!

I don't see why you wouldn't get good volume with your bread - hard wheat has strong gluten! I look forward to seeing the results...

Michael

 

 

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

 

 

Michael,

Today's bake experimenting with 10% spelt in the Chai loaf I have been baking lately.  I added spelt to this dough and I do think it made a difference not only on volume but also in proofing time.  The other Chai loaves that I have baked this week all took longer to proof - hard to say how much difference in volume though....no exact science in this kitchen *^).

No crumb shots either as these are headed out the door to friend's houses as soon as they are completely cool.

(Second shot was taken 10 minutes after they were loaded into my Cadco.  They were steamed and then the heat was turned off for those 10 minutes.)

Thanks for your post.  I love it when I learn a new aspect about the grains I bake with, and prior to your post, I did not know about the amylase in spelt.

Take Care,

Janet

mwilson's picture
mwilson

Wow, just wow! Those look incredible Janet. So Perfect!

I can see those loaves have really good strength. Slashes are so exact and precise. These could feature on the SFBI website. Very professional!

Don't need a crumb shot, I could look at those pictures all day! Your friends should be honored to receive such works of art.

That trick with the oven is always helpful!

I'm glad you've learnt something new. The more we share the more we learn!

Regards,

Michael

 

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Michael,

I blush with the praise you have bestowed upon these loaves.  Thank you for you very kind words.

If you only knew the disasters I have had with trying to score countless other loaves......Scoring is not my forte and for awhile I even gave up trying but then I was leafing through my copy of Advanced Bread and Pastries and saw this pattern and gave it a try.  It has worked every time I have done it!!!!  I also put the almost completely proofed boules into the refrig. for a bit before scoring and that might have helped - the oven wasn't up to temp. and I wanted to slow things down rather than run into overproofing.

Yes, it is the sharing here that has made such a big difference in my understanding of baking and I am always delighted when I find something new that I can actually understand and do *-).

Tomorrow I am doing this again but mixing Kamut and spelt - 5% each - in with the remaining 90% of hard white wheat.  Actually that batch will be baked on Saturday.  Tomorrow's is hard red wheat with 10% spelt.  Still using the Chai base.....

Again, thank you for your more than kind and generous praise.

Take Care,

Janet

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

on your loaf Michael.  It must taste great too.  You only kneeded it by hand for 5-10 minutes.  Maybe you can throw the mixer away now :-)  We know better though.  Put some spelt in the Semolina bread today, based on your bread, to see if it helps the rise any.  We know it will help round out the taste and flavor. 

Nice baking as usual. 

mwilson's picture
mwilson

I let fermentation do most of the kneading. Well I say that, but the kneading I did was very energetic. The added acidity makes the gluten tense and I certainly could feel it. It took a lot of muscle to get the development I wanted but luckily it didn't take long...

Planetary mixers are pretty useless when it comes to kneading to be fair. But they are handy for the initial mixing.

I'm chuffed that I've encouraged you to use spelt. Although I'm not sure if it'll help the rise, Spelt is weak, no doubt about it.

Cheers dabrownman

 

 

nicodvb's picture
nicodvb

Hi Michael, I agree with you that planetary mixers are pretty useless at making bread. I find that they make such a stupid movement that it's really suprising that they can spit out something remotely useful. I consider planetaries a good start, but just a start.

As for spelt I read in several papers that the flour is generally high in amylase activity, up to the level f rye but without the added protease enzymes (basically because -for some reason that I don't remember- it's harvested late, when it has already begun sprouting). Spelt flour alone is extremely weak, but it's a good source of sugars.

I love your engeneering approach! It always yields fantastic results.

  Nico

mwilson's picture
mwilson

What we need is a domestic spiral mixer. Can't see why it would be difficult to make... If I had the time and money I'd probably make my own mixer out of wood!

Now that you mention it, that would make sense that spelt has high amylase activity, that's why my first 100% all spelt loaf was very red brown in colour...

Cheers Nico

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Nico,

Thanks for the info. on the spelt grain and amylase.  Now it  makes sense why MiniOven says 'rye and spelt like each other.'

I always thought spelt was a weak flour and would produce denser loaves and when I had tried using it alone I did get dense breads..... but then Juergen baked several breads that were 100% spelt, HERE, and when I tried his formula with my grains I was pleasantly surprised to see that it rose just as well as my 100% ww loaves.  It is now a favorite bread for one of the people I bake for regularly so I have had to re-evaluate my former opinion of it.  (NB - I always bake with 100% whole grains so I never get the crumb structure people get here using BF or AP so my expectations and results are very different.)

Janet

nicodvb's picture
nicodvb

to have been useful, Janet! 

Spelt is weak, very weak. Every time I used it I experienced what was to be expected: the dough came together very well, but there was a massive release of liquids (and loss of shape!) after just a couple of hours of fermentation, evidently due to the massive activity of amylase. I should try to add some ascorbic acid to see if the acidification is sufficient to limit the action of the enzyme and strengthen the gluten somewhat. At the moment I'm using the spelt flour remained to make biscuits. There's an ingredient that spelt loves more than rye: butter :-)

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

you up on your 100% spelt challenge but will do it with Kamut. I tried to get about half a pound out of the bin at Whole Foods and 3 pounds came out in an instant -  so it will be a very high hydration Kamut or bust!!  Kamut  has much less protein than spelt so I figure we will mix it for 2 hours  minimum on KA 2 :-)

mwilson's picture
mwilson

Brilliant!

Can't wait to see how it goes..

The intial challenge obviously wasn't hard enough if you feel the need to up the ante using Kamut.

I hope you don't break your mixer! I mixed mine by hand... ;)