The Fresh Loaf

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Wild Yeast Water Oat Egg Rolls

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isand66's picture
isand66

Wild Yeast Water Oat Egg Rolls

I have some left over brisket and pulled pork in the freezer I defrosted to for this weekend so I wanted to make some rolls that would be good for sandwiches.  I have been experimenting with my Wild Yeast Water Starter over the last month or so with some mixed results.  My last experiment to convert a recipe for New England style hot dog buns to WYW ended up with bread sticks so this time I was determined not to make the same mistakes as previously.

I have decided to believe what I have been told and made sure to build the starter up over at least 2 stages versus the one stage for the hot dog fiasco.  If you want to know more about starting your own WYW starter let me know and I will be glad to help you.  It is really easy to start and maintain and WYW does not have nearly as much of a sour tang as sourdough starters.

For this recipe as I mentioned I built my starter up over 2 phases four hours apart using AP flour and WYW.  I ended up with extra starter since I would rather over-estimate the amount needed than under-estimate.  Feel free to cut back on the WYW and flour about 10%.

Procedure

Wild Yeast Water Starter Build 1

210 grams AP Flour

210 grams WYW

Mix the flour and the WYW in a bowl and leave covered at room temperature for 4-5 hours.

Wild Yeast Water Starter Build2

200 grams AP Flour

56 grams WYW

Mix additional ingredients into Build 1 and use your hands to make sure all the ingredients are incorporated.  You should have a fairly firm 65% starter.  Leave covered for 4-5 hours at room temperature and then either proceed to main dough or refrigerate over night.

Main Dough

425 grams WYW Starter from Above

200 grams Bread Flour (KAF)

200 grams First Clear Flour (KAF) (This is typically used in Rye breads and I enjoy the nice chewy texture it adds to rolls)

100 grams Oat Flour (KAF)

78 grams White Whole Wheat Flour (KAF)

18 grams Salt (Seas Salt or Table Salt)

121 grams Egg Yolks (around 6-7 large eggs)

298 grams Water (85 - 90 degrees)

26 grams Olive Oil

Add all the water except 50 grams to the starter to break it up in your mixing bowl.  Next add all of the flours and mix on low for 2 minutes.  Let the dough autolyse for around 15 - 20 minutes. This will help the dough absorb the flour.  Next add the salt, remaining water and the olive oil and mix for 2 minutes on speed number 1 and 2 minutes on speed number 2.  You should have a nice smooth dough which is still tacky.  Move the dough onto your work surface and dust lightly with flour if necessary or spray some cooking spray instead.  Most of the time if the dough is not a high hydration I will not use anything on my wood board.

Do 4  stretch and folds and form the dough into a ball and leave uncovered for 10 minutes.  After the first rest do another stretch and fold and cover the dough.  Let it rest for another 10 minutes and then do another stretch and fold.  You can now put the dough into a lightly oiled container or bowl and cover it.  Let it sit at room temperature for 2 additional hours or less if it is warm in your kitchen.  After 2 hours place the covered bowl in the refrigerator for 1 - 3 days until ready to bake.

When you are ready to make your rolls take the dough out of the refrigerator and keep it in its bowl at room temperature for 1.5 -  2 hours.  After its rest it is time to shape the rolls.  Depending on how big you want the rolls, first cut the dough in half and then roll half the dough into a log.  Next cut off the desired size piece you want and roll it into a tight ball.  Place rolls on cookie sheet and cover the rolls with a clean lint free towel sprayed with water or a piece of plastic wrap lightly sprayed with cooking spray.  Let the rolls rest at room temperature for 2 hours or until they are at least 1.5 the size.

Make an egg wash with a little egg wash and apply to each roll and put on desired toppings.  I used toasted onions, poppy seeds and also Charnushka seeds or also known as Nigelia Sativa which are tiny black seeds used on Jewish rye breads as well as Slavic sausages and in Armenian and Israeli cooking.

Around 30 minutes before baking the rolls, prepare your oven and pre-heat at 500 degrees.  I used my usual set-up for steam and added 1 cup of boiling water to a pan on the bottom shelf but for rolls you could omit this step and you will get softer rolls if that is what you desire.  After adding the steam lower the oven to 425 degrees and continue baking.

It should take around 20-25 minutes to bake the rolls and they should be nice and brown on the bottom and top.  When done, let them cool on a wire rack and enjoy.

The rolls ended up nice and chewy and light with a nice open crumb.

This post has been submitted to the Yeast Spotting Site here: http://www.wildyeastblog.com/category/yeastspotting/.

Lily
Pineapple Lily
Dahlia

Comments

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

hamburger buns Ian.  The perfect crumb and crust you would expect from YW buns baked to perfection.  The BBQ pork sandwiches must have been very good!  These buns are some very nice baking!  From my experimental formula point of view they are nearly perfect.

When I see a nice bake like yours (YW or SD) and they have kindly supplied the recipe like you do,  I like to analyze it to see where it fits on the recipe scale I am trying to develop - so that my apprentice can whip up a bread on her own without any worries that it might fail or potentially have a problem. 

First off we want the bread and the levain to end up with the same hydration to make mixing it easier and calculating easier.  We want the YW to be 40% of the total weight of the levain with the flour 60% - from experience this seems to work.  We want the levain to be around 30% of the total flour and liquid weight to keep proofing and developement times reasonable.   I also like the levain flour to be somewhere around 40-50% of the dough flour.  These just seem to work for YW breads. 

We too like multiple builds for YW levains.  Wre prefer 3 with the last one being just flour.  In the summer we prefer 4 hour first build, 3 hour 2nd build and 2 hour 3rd build where the bulk of the YW and flour are in the first build and the times get shorter so the yeast doesn't run out of food and is at full potential for the bake.  The hydration is the key since whole grains require more water.  Experience tell you what range the hydration needs to be in base on the flours used.   But, if you know the hydration and the weight you want to end up with then the calculating is easy to come up with a recipe that works and allows you to build the exact amount of levain required - so no waste.

I took the liberty of using your recipe and used our 3 builds for the levains to your totals to see how your recipe falls into the model.  I was shocked  when I saw it.  The only thing closer to perfect, for the model,  would be 1 or 2 g more of dough water.  You have a very nice YW dough formula indeed!  If you want the spreadsheet will send it to you.

Ian's YW Buns     
      
 Build 1 Build 2Build 3Total% of Total
YW11060 17040.00%
Flour110955025560.00%
Total 22015550425 
Time of Build4 Hr3 Hr2 Hr  
Hydration100.00%82.93%66.67%  
      
Dough Flour578    
Dough Water298    
E. Yolk Liquid (50%)86   Whole egg would be 75%
      
Total Liquid554    
Total Flour833    
Total Hydration66.45%    
      
Total Dough Weight1,387    Flour and liquid only 
      
Levain % of Dough30.65%    
L. Flour % of D. Flour44.12%    

 

isand66's picture
isand66

Thanks DA....I usually just hand write out the formula and make sure it falls within the percentages I am looking for and I adjust as I am mixing if I feel the dough is too dry or wet.

I will never use a 1 build process again for the YW as that has failed miserably.  I have done 2 builds and 3 both with great success.

Thank you for taking the time to put it in your spread sheet.

If you could email it that would be great.

One of these days I will start to use the spread sheets, but I feel I keep over analyzing it and then I get frustrated and just write it down in my note book instead!

Thanks as always for your encouragment and feedback and for pushing me into the YW realm....it has opened up a new world of possibilities.  I have so many cook books and recipes that I should be using but I can't seem to help just doing my own thing thanks to the inspiration of you and others on this site.

Tomorrow we are having some company over and I'm going to make a pulled pork pizza inspired by one of the shows I saw on The Food Network.  We will also serve some of my brisket I had frozen along with some fresh mozz salad, guac and some roasted bbq potatoes....at least that's the plan.  Don't think it will live up to some of the spreads you have shown, but should be enjoyable I hope :)

Hoping to start seeing some tomatoes from my garden in a week or so before I have to leave for another trip to China.

Thanks again.

Ian

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

love your flowers too!

isand66's picture
isand66

Thanks!  It's getting hard to keep them happy....been very dry and hot....not as bad as you of course, but bad enough.  Just spent half of today trying to fix my sprinklers.

 

 

RedL's picture
RedL

I'll have to admit I just threw my yeast water out.  I had a hard time getting the dough to rise enough, plus I couldn't get the hang of feeding the YW.  After seeing yours though I'll have to try again.  Your instructions should make it very easy. 

 You must have a beautiful and interesting garden, I've never seen a pineapple lily. 

Very nice write up!

  

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

is 6 parts honey and 1 part sugar and a half an apple, no skin, diced and about 6 cherries cut in half this time of year.   The honey is about a tablespoon and the sugar is 1/2 tsp .  I usually hold over some fruit maybe 6 - 8 pieces to include with the new and use about 1/6 C of the old YW filling the remaining 18 oz peanut butter jar 3/4 full.  Let it sit our for a few hours, say 3-4 to get going then into the fridge it goes.  Will easily keep a week this way.  Ian probably feeds his differently but we got the cherry thing from him :-)

isand66's picture
isand66

Thanks Red.  I appreciate the kind words.

My wife loves lilies and she found that one I think from a catalog.

Do give the YW a try again.  If you use multiple builds once you get yours going, it is real easy.

Per DA's post below you can easily refresh it once you get it going.  I don't add as much sugar as he does, but I may give that a try as well.

thanks again.

Ian

varda's picture
varda

and the pineapple lily, which I'd never seen either.    Thanks for the details on making them.   I had enjoyed baking with YW for awhile and then after one too many failures gave up on it.    I will take a look at this post before I make my next attempt.   -Varda

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

spreadsheet for new recipies.  Have sent it off to you.  It ignores sprouts and add ins that don't effect hydration.  Just plug in the numbers and it calculates to let you quickly modify to hit what ever numbers you are looking for. 

Your BBQ spread sounds like a nice addition to the rolls.  Made BBQ yesterday with odds and ends of pork out of the freezer - no ribs though.  Had to make a new batch of rub which always is a little different because we are out of one thing or another.  Beans and potatoes salad were better than the meat.

I think I like your own bread thing better than reading a book.  It is more fun to explore the wild unknown than be cramped into a corner with Y,S, F &W bread at this point.  I don't feel bad about messing with your formulas and enjoy reading about your concoctions that often turn out so well. 

Bake on my friend.